Depch

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Depch last won the day on March 28

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About Depch

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    NHL94 Lord

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  • Preferred System
    Genesis
  • Favorite Way To Score
    Rebound

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    Male
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    Helsinki, Finland

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    harri.nissinen(at)gmail.com

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  1. By default most connections should be steady nowadays. For overseas by default do not use smoothing. The +1 frame adds to input lag that is already high from the latency alone. Problems with specific connections should be more rare by default, if you experience problems with someone then consider using smoothing, but do not use it pre-emptively (it would be silly). What was meant is that Discord eats a lot of resources for a chat/voIP program. So especially for older computers it's good to turn off while gaming. Some of the players who play Overwatch for example with more powerfull computers turn it also off and use something like Mumble for VoIP, which is more lighter.
  2. Discord is very heavy to use. Some of the guys who play Overwatch competitively told me this and that they shut it down while playing with more powerfull desktop computers. For VoIP there are more lighter options during gameplay. But I like discord for how it connects people, it's good for chat and PM for me.
  3. I don't know what UB exactly means but I guess it is to do with connection on a breakdown / desync. It tries to help it with adding rope to the connection with extra latency, but 4ms is not really much so I'm not even using that. I think Hamachi pays no difference here. It's just a tool to give you a virtual IP-address and fake a LAN connection with guys in the same network via those IP-addresses. The connection itself should be direct between the players so that the data does not go through any hamachi server or so. Of course in theory it's better the less programs are running in the background, especially online ones. Client-server is very bad for gaming nowadays, especially arcade games, doesn't matter for turn based etc. Let's say there is a server in east coast NY where you have 2on2 servers for example. Guys close by get 10-20ms to it, which equals a P2P connection of 20-40ms so 1 to 2 frames. If I would connect there I would play with 7 frames. This is the reason I do not play 2on2. I have yet to try it with lag compensation, perhaps it would make it playable. The other side usually gets to play with a huge advantage, but advantages can be overcome of course. A server in iceland could work good, but there are still advantages to the other side, it's impossible to get a 100% even connection there. P2P Gens/Kaillera offers is pretty good.
  4. That is A type lag. High latency -> delay in your controls. If the game on Pearate end is all smooth then it's probably not the connection causing it but something on his computer rather or the rare compatibility issue. On P2P connection if the other connection has packetloss/high fluctuation in ping then both experience it.
  5. Oh, great news. Why not ditch Gens and play with Kega. The emulation is smoother and closer to real Genesis as well. The last time I tested Kega online was probably somewhere in the last decade, perhaps it's netcode has also been updated. It also eliminates the problem of someone gaining advantage of rerecording and it's lag compensation over someone who does not. If Kega does not however have a updated netplay and it's like I recall it to be then it's still a bad option (for me). Kega also has default linux version that run 100% smooth on Linux, just tried the 3.63x version from the site. Gens has to be emulated by wine. http://www.segaretro.org/Kega_Fusion#Downloads
  6. Yes Kega is much smoother but you guys should be below/around 100ms in ping to still make it playable. When it gets to 140ms+ it should be too slow and unbearable to me at least. Also how would you send a savestate to the site to have that game show up there? Only option would be to do it manually in a gens afterwards, sounds like awfully a lot to do.
  7. To answer your first question. Yes, do not use smoothing. It is only good against jumpy screen problem. Otherwise you only ADD to latency, which makes A type of lag worse aka long distance connections. Like the word smoothing says it is to smoothen down an edgy / jumpy connection by adding artificial latency to the connection to not react to jumpiness in ping, which is worse for response. In kaillera Ping = Frames = Latency = A type Lag. The more frames, the more delay in your controls, that is bad for competitive gaming. To the second question. So when you say I have a better connection to you than the french, it should be defined better to get to the root of that. There are many types of lag like I explained. My connection is low speed but very stable. Speed has very little difference in connections when it comes to NHL94. I have a DSL, which is probably 10/1 at the moment. I've been with this connection since last fall. Before this one I had a 24/3 DSL, which allowed a 10ms lower ping to eastern coast US as I was working then with a ISP/ICT company and I was able to adjust the settings for the DSL myself. Ping is dictated by distance traveled, it is a measure of time between two points. When Seth says he now has a faster internet and how everone should update, he is wrong. It does not matter. Changing ISP can help with B type of lag, but not A and that has nothing to do with the connection speed usually. "Faster" internet only allows to send more packets sent with the same actual speed than a "slower" internet. There you can think of the term "bandwidth". Slower have less width for fewer data packages, but the speed is actually the same. The actual single data does not move faster, it just has more bandwidth and allows to move more data at the same time. Speed only matters in shared connections like old cable, shared households or if you run other stuff background when playing. Your ping should be lower vs the french, so the response should be better for controls. I had a relatively high ping vs the other french guy, probably pearate if I recall it right and it was somewhere around 80ms when it should have been in the 50ms-60ms range to France in general. Your problems vs them should by theory be in the B lag category, with jumping screen / dropping fps. If that is not the case even with lower ping, then something else is causing the problem than the distance / network, perhaps something on pearate's end.
  8. Yes, very good topics Aqua. I modified my long post and it should be easier to read now. It's still a wall of text but should cover majority of the issues. This has been an issue for me in the past as well and now that there are possible tools to help in it it is for the community to decide what direction all this goes. There is nothing much else I can provide. I'd prefer the competitive way and reverting back would probably make me look at other games. Probably frustration shining through here as I've tried to be vocal about it.
  9. Know the lag you are facing. Lag is commonly defined to having problems in online gaming but not especially defined what it is. For TLDR type guys I recommend to read at least A & B. A ) Over long distance there will always be delay with how modern physics work unless something new is found. So even with the speed of light there will be a harsh input delay between the continents on p2p or client side connection. This is what I usually call lagging, it's a high ping aka high latency. It makes your controller inputs work in delay, so that it's much harder to react to the opponent in real time and this results in a very poor defence and horrendous manual goaltending, it makes pass shots etc. much more difficult. In Kaillera lag is defined by frames. 20ms ping = 1 frame 30ms ping = 2 frame 60ms ping = 3 frame 90ms ping = 4 frame 110ms ping = 5 frame 140ms ping = 6 frame 180ms ping = 7 frame At least it's something along those lines. Intercontinental connections tend to be between 1-3. At best I get 4 frame games to eastern coast and they are great to play and it's really not much of a problem. Even 5 frame games up to 135 ms ping are still relatively good and responsive. I get 5 frame games up to the area of Buffalo / Toronto / Montreal. When you play overseas games _DO NOT USE ADDED FRAMES_ as it adds to the input delay, only do it if B is the case. B ) Lag spikes or jumpy screen. Now this is the type of lag that is most commonly caused by a bad network on the other side. Modern networks everywhere should be good and fast enough for games like nhl94 that don't require much speed at all to play it good. You're completely fine with a 10/1 and those should be available everywhere nowadays. But spikes / jumpy screen are a different case. This is most commonly caused by one of the following: -Someone else using your bandwidth for downloading / streaming -Using wi-fi instead of cable. Wi-fi can have problems with it's signal to your computer from other electrical devices, yes even outside your house. So having a wi-fi in your room even might not solve the case. -3G forget about it and also 4G might cause problems. -Bad connection from your house to the ISP and you should contact them to fix it -Bad routing between ISP and the servers beyond, contact ISP -Check for malicious programs on your computer / do a clean install for OS etc. It takes some problemsolving skills to figure out which one is causing the spiky connection. This is usually commonly figured out by the community who has it or not. Habs for example has been nominated for having a spiky connection quite a few times. You can also self diagnose it a bit by using ping in command prompt. Just type "ping 8.8.8.8 -t" in command prompt without the " marks. If the ping is stable, something else is causing it. If there are massive jumps by even 30+ ms then your connection is the cause. ONLY USE ADDED FRAMES IF YOU ARE FACING OPPONENT WHO YOU HAVE PROBLEMS WITH JUMPY SCREEN / CONNECTION WITH SPIKES. And to be honest, I prefer the faster response much more over some FPS lags or occasional spikes. C) There is the rare case that goes behind the case B with some hardware issues like Raph said. I also had this problem with a desktop computer having i7-2600K against Seths old laptop. They would get somehow off sync and it would be smooth on Seths end but jumpy screen for me. For some vs Seth it would be completely fine and the issue might happen against some other guys, but always the same guys between specific setups, this is very rare though. With an old 8 year old Laptop this would not happen, not vs Seths new laptop or his old. It's a problem I have no fix for, try runnning different OS or setups the only one other than getting a new computer. As a quick fix I used to do ALT-ALT during the game to quickly visit the Gens menu and reset the low FPS back to 60 for a moment to get it back smooth, but this was annoying and distracting during the games. It also could cause a problem to leave it smooth for me but severely handicapping you with a huge delay compared to Seth where the other can skate circles around you and you are a pylon. It kind of like increased the delay visiting the menu to make it more like a server-client connection. D) Dropping FPS is usually happening between one of or all of these combinations, it should be more rare on the A case where the connections are stable even with high ping. I have some of that against quite a few players here with the old laptop, so that might be hardware related as well. But we have to remember Gens is a very old program and we used to play with it in the early 2000's already so it's made to run with very bad computers for modern standards. Hardware seldomly should be the problem with this. Any Core2Duo for example should be 100% fine with Gens already. Possible solutions: I've played many games competitively from FPS to more modern NHL games etc. and it is a custom to tweak your configurations in FPS games for example. It's never considered a cheat and those that are, are pre-defined by the community. Games like Quake and Team Fortress 2 use lag compensation and tbh if you don't use it it's almost impossible to play overseas as they are even more hectic than nhl94. In FPS games people even modify the polling rates of USB devices from registry so that they respond over 125hz and give a faster response and it's a custom, not a cheat. It is a possible advantage over the casual gamers but also help to competitive gameplay. If I play FPS games with such setups I would not do registry changes just to revert back to play NHL94. Back to the lag case in lag compensation. What lag compensation intends to do is to reduce the discrepancy in the time of response to offer smoother gameplay. If you want to read more you can find about client side lag compensation from here http://www.gamedonia.com/blog/lag-compensation-techniques-for-multiplayer-games-in-realtime. The problem with this is that it only exists in Gens rerecording that also has a small graphical glitch at times with nhl94. We would have to have programmer to take a look at it and implement lag compensation from rerecording to the current version people are using in Gens or fix the graphical glitch issue in rerecording and make rerecording the default version to play with. The default packages on nhl94online.com should be updated anyways with new kaillera and record plugins etc, why not have rerecording in it as well. To those who say it is a cheat I say you do now know what it does. There is a chance for using it to create an unadvantageous situation and cause delay on the other end and I know for 99% I have experienced this before figuring this out in the NA games, if creating the delay is done deliberately then it is a malicious act and it could only be countered by using it yourself. At best making this available for everyone could possibly help with the lag type A and make games much more enjoyable on all sides. Lag compensation offers a compensation in frames from 0 to 4 for a faster input response. Embracing all the tools to make games more competitive is a good sign of a community and shutting yourself from it is like being run by the medieval church and trying to keep the people uninformed, as like it's a heresy! After figuring this out in 2017 I am finally able to play to the level I used to play in Finnish leagues aka emulate short distance latency. And can honestly say that if the competitive side of NHL94 does not make an effort to look at this issue or solve it, it will probably make me ditch out NHL94 from my games to play list. It is a game I enjoy playing competitively and I will not go back from this to play NA games where I cannot use B-checks anymore, I had to bear that for 2 years already. My conscience is clean and I've been very open about this and trying to make it available for everyone. There is just very little response or I get the casual gamer response to it. Gens settings might have effect for online gaming as well. It's an old emulator and it's code might be still derived from the early 2000's in some part. Many old games had codes written that their network emulation somehow was in link with the settings, perhaps it was part of the poor hardware at the time as well, but it existed. We in Finland had a gentlemans code to run games with low sound settings to make things smoother for everyone, at least I was part of it. The problem is that if not everyone uses the same settings, then it's possibly a different kind of response for everyone as the theory is that it effects the opponent as well. Those who want to run everything at highest are at an advantage. Now there is no way to prove this as we can only experience it on our own end. Only in LAN environment or so you could fully test it out and see the difference or perhaps starting several gens on your unit and trying it out connecting between those. Gens in general has a very bulky and heavy feel to it and to me it helps me to lower the sound settings or even graphical renderer to have a smoother experience. You can try RetroArch and just be overwhelmed how smooth that is, even Kega and Snes are much more smooth. But what Gens has in advantage to other tested emulators vs Kega for example is that it's much better for long distance connections somehow. A type of lag in Kega or even SNES becomes unbearable if I recall it right overseas. RetroArch has not been tested. Plus what the other emulators lack are the netplaysave option in the form nhl94online.com supports to really be able to use them without any modifications to site/emulators themselves. Another possible job for programmers.
  10. I just re-installed my Linux. I was using Linux mint Cinnamon 17.x before and that required some work to get things work out even though Cinnamon should be the flagship of the Linux Mint brand. Now I'm using Linux Mint 18.1 Xfce version and I only had to install Wine + Playonlinux from the software manager and everything works like charmed. Just installed the plugins Wine prompted about when starting Gens and netplay is fine as well. Perhaps it was about the version number more than about Cinnamon vs Xfce. Under Cinnamon 17.x I had some performance issues with my old laptop, but 18.1 Xfce is really really smooth so I don't even have to reboot to Windows anymore to play Gens. I had XP running alongside Cinnamon for Gens. For anyone considering Linux Mint I recommend the Xfce over Cinnamon easily and especially for older computers. Cinnamon eats up quite some resources (still not as much as Windows) and I'm not missing anything from that compared to Xfce. [edit] Confirmed that everything was cool playing JV 5 games this morning with the following settings. #1 Linux Mint Xfce 18.1 #2 From software manager install Wine + Playonlinux #3 Use the following guide to install Hamachi & Haguichi as a GUI https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Hamachi #4 Install the updates Wine prompts when starting Gens ^ And netplay, record player and everything works on the go if you have the right Gens package, Kaillera etc.
  11. I'm just going to bump this so people will notice this more easily. Et tu Brute has already been running in discord for a while and there are 46 members connected to the NHL94 server. After using Discord for a while I can say that It's easy to use. I'm only running discord in a browser and don't have any apps installed. Just need to create the account and use the join link below. I like the chat as well and the dark theme it has (you can change to a lighter one from settings as well). https://discordapp.com/invite/0por6zfp5RodSFVL For me this is much better than AIM and as there are a lot of communities under it, it's probably easier to find other retro gamers who already have an account to discord if just put an effort to it. In some other communities Discord has taken the place of IRC.
  12. You can get kaillera to work on Linux, but I think it requires some vb libraries installed on Linux for it to run properly. You might want to check this post by wboy to get nose work where it's done. http://forum.nhl94.com/index.php?/topic/16863-nose-on-linux/&do=findComment&comment=163596 You can find other Linux information from below. http://forum.nhl94.com/index.php?/topic/15828-linux-question/&do=findComment&comment=163652 Perhaps some Linux version run the casual gens normally but I had to use rerecording and they're 100% compatible with rerecording having some extra settings.
  13. This is exactly the same with some pass shots. To "fool" the goalie to follow a certain trajectory where the puck is expected to go from the players momentum and then do something that does not disturb the movement so the goalie does not fix the position. It helps a lot when you gain experience from doing these by repetition so you will be able to do them when when the goalie has just moved so it will be even harder to make a save by the AI. When it comes from the backbone and there is no need to think how you do it, then you've become efficient with them. Off topic: For pad vs kbrd conversation: This type of move is where keyboard is easier to perform with, but for me smooth deking is much harder with it and the skating seems somewhat bulky at times. But if you can do the floater with a pad then you can do certain pass shots as well, they just need to be done a tad faster with some more wiggle/deke moves-> more precision required. Advantages and disadvantages.
  14. NHL95 Looks fine, it was also probably more popular overall in Finland than 94 was, actually overall it was the first one to be a huge hit in sells of hockey games. I have one problem with the Genesis version of 95 though. The skating seems much more hectic and less precise than compared to 94. If that was not the case I think you could do pass shots in 95 effectively as well, but now it seems just so much more random and almost impossible to line up properly for the diagonal ones. Am I wrong here and is it just a lack of experience on the game or can you use skating skill to line up for great effectiviness for pass shots? The hectic style skating also looks like it's going to be real bad for high latency. It feels like the point for your weight is very high instead of down low. Looks fun for live events and low 1-3 frame latency games though.
  15. That would be a smart option, but I would feel "cheap" doing that for some reason. Perhaps I could use that against players who would use that move themselves, similar to 5 hole passes. I thought Zep meant with Coffey, but that was impossible to stop.