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First Round Calibre Players (Weight Bug)

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Premium    18

I believe that there are 18 players in the weight bugged version of NHL '94 that are suitable as first round players. As a result of this, I also believe any weight-bugged draft league should include no more than 18 coaches :)

TIER I

1. Steve Yzerman

2. Petr Klima

3a. Jeremy Roenick

3b. Alexander Mogilny

5. Mike Gartner

TIER 2

6. Pavel Bure

7a. Dino Ciccarelli

7b. Teemu Selanne

7c. Wayne Gretzky

10. Theoren Fleury

TIER 3 

11. Pat LaFontaine

12. Adam Oates

TIER 4

13. Mario Lemieux

14a. Mike Modano

14b. Russ Courtnall

16. Mark Recchi

17. Doug Gilmour

18. Cliff Ronning

-------------------

FAKE FIRST ROUNDERS (avoid these traps!!)

  • Sergei Fedorov
  • Luc Robitaille
  • Brett Hull
  • Joe Sakic
  • Brian Bradley
  • Tomas Sandstrom
  • Peter Bondra

B)

Edited by Premium
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aqualizard    42

Interesting!  Any chance of you starting a Plablegs League capped at 17 coaches then?  Go for it!  Would be cool!  (There are probably only 15-17 guys that aren't slackers, so it all adds up!)

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Premium    18

I'm R-E-T-I-R-E-D. Someone else can take it up :D

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TomKabs93    7

I really like this idea and list

You could say the tiers are like:

Tier 1: Superstars

Tier 2: Flawed Superstars

Tiers 3 and 4: Superflawed Superstars

I lump tiers 3 and 4 together because I personally think both Oates and Laf def belong in the tier below. I think it should just be 3 tiers but I totally respect other opinions as its subjective. 

 

Ill post my updated version of this list with my personal choice changes, but overall I really agree about the "big 18."

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Lol disrespecting Roenick again smh. 

There is no realm in the world where Yzerman is N1 you god damn goons. 

Real s**t is :

#1. JR

#2. Mogs

#3. Bure

Edited by The Russian Rocket
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Premium    18

I don't think so and here is why: The JR everyone thinks about is the boosted one from Classic with home advantages to beef up his stats. The Yzerman everyone thinks about is the one who doesn't have the luxury of juicing his stats like Roenick does.

I believe that Yzerman is the superior player when it's evened out. Yzerman has the advantage in agility (the best stat in the game), and his awareness is higher. Roenick has a 5/5 shot, but the shot tends to matter less when you don't need to score from far out, and it's not like Yzerman can't anyway. Roenick is also lighter, but that is not a very big factor in my opinion. My defensive play stays the same regardless of who I have on my team.

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kingraph    133

Here's my draft list, where I ranked my GDL player selection.  It was meant more for the draft, but I think the same applies as an overall.

forum.nhl94.com/index.php?/topic/17507-gdl-draft-strategy-1st-round/

Plabax and I have the same tier 1, though I think the top 3 are even more special (mogs, yzerman, JR). 

I do rate Modano higher, but that might be due to speed scarcity in a draft vs overall.  I definitely disagree on Cliff Ronning, that's the only real difference of opinion I have is I'd rather have a top G or D or Sandy/Hull vs Cliff.

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No. The one I'm thinking about is very GDL. 

Whatever I really don't get the excitement on Yzerman. He's not elite at ANYTHING. 

Edited by The Russian Rocket

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TomKabs93    7
3 minutes ago, The Russian Rocket said:

No. The one I'm thinking about is very GDL. 

Whatever I really don't get the excitement on Yzerman. He's not elite at ANYTHING. 

How is bure elite at anything?

 

Hes literally worse than yzerman in every single way

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Premium    18

Well, all JR has over Yzerman is shooting. Is Dino better than Yzerman too?

Yzerman has an elite shot, elite skating (I think the best), elite awareness and is a great stick handler.

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4/5 is not an elite shot.  4/6, 5/5, 5/4 and 6/3 are elite shots. JR is a better C checker and his 5 SHP is much more precious than the 6-5 agi drop vs elite GC players. 

As for TK, well he got that 99 locked speed. 

Mogs is just better than Yzerman and at 6 agi the 1 extra weight doesnt mean much. 

Edited by The Russian Rocket

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TomKabs93    7

but 6 5 skating is definitely better than 5 6 skating imo :huh:

6 5 skating gives you all kinds of agility to deke precisely in close quarters, while still giving you great speed. 5 6 skating is faster for sure, but considerably sloppier when it comes to any stop up, turn, or start. Even 5 5 skating is better than 5 6 skating in my books because its more agile aka gives you more skating control. 5 5 vs 5 6 I'm probably in the minority though.

So while bure has yzerman beat in the speed department, i cant really count that as a plus cuz imo yzermans skating ability as a whole >>> bures

It's cool though that there are so many different opinions on such important game matters. I like that we disagree fpb, you know, different strokes for different strokes and all that stuff

Edited by TomKabs93

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Premium    18

I disagree. I think 4/5 is good enough especially when 99% of your goals are within 1cm of the goalie's face anyway lol. Wayne Gretzky can score way more goals than Brett Hull and he has one of the worst shots in the game.

Yes JR is a better C checker, but who cares really. You were crying when you had Nelson Emerson and Dallas Drake (in GDL) while I was crushing the competition in Blitz with 0 C checks in 100+ games.

Edited by Premium

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Well if 99% of your goals are in front of the goalie you're not utilizing a 5/5 shot properly. 

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Premium    18

Still helped me when win more than you ever did :)

Edited by Premium

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Premium    18

Anyway.. With JR, most of your goals are going to be from shots that would go in with a 4/5 shot anyway. That's what I want to say. The 5/5 shot is definitely a bonus though. I just think the 6 agility 5 speed bonus is greater.

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Well no. That's the whole point. JR can score from 20% farther with the same setup. It draws defenses out of the ''collapse'' and is too strong to be dealt purely with GC. 

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Premium    18

Seeing as you didn't shoot a very high percentage with JR , I'm not too sure I agree that it is "too strong". It's just a tad better than the 4/5. I'm sure almost all of the goals you scored with Roenick would have went in with a 4/5 shot as well.

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I've had most other elite 4/5 shots before. It's really not the same. JR can shoot as some precise angles others cannot.  Also why Cicc is #2 in all-time GS

Edited by The Russian Rocket

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Premium    18

The reason why Roenick and Ciccarelli have such high point totals in GDL is because the coaches controlling them were just chasing records and abusing the players.

I scored as many goals in GDL 16 as you did in GDL 15, and your top scorer was Roenick with 388 points whereas mine was Jari Kurri with 226 points.

I'm the only coach to score over 400 goals in a GDL season more than once, and I'm nowhere to be found on the record list. My best is 241 points.

 

 

Edited by Premium

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Prolly cause you assume it's easier. But you've never proved you actualyl CAN score more with 1 guy and keep the pace. 

Edited by The Russian Rocket

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Premium    18

It's obviously easier when you consider that the top scorer is almost always one of the top players. Since GDL 6 it's been Mogilny, Klima, Klima, Klima, Klima, Ciccarelli, Klima, Mogilny, Roenick, Klima.

You don't think it's player abuse? You had 744 shots on goal with Jeremy Roenick, and you said you only play regular season games to chase the recorde. I didn't even have a player hit 300 shots in either of my 410+ goal seasons. 

Take a look at the percentage of a team's shots and points a player produces:

For you, Roenick produced 78% of your shots and 42% of your points. Total of 420 goals

For you, Klima produced 63% of your shots and 39% of your points. Total of 393 goals (on pace for 400)

For Raph, Ciccarelli produced 63% of his shots 37% of his points. Total of 442 goals

For me, Oates produced 28% of my shots and 26% of my points. Total of 412 goals

For me, Kurri produced 26% of my shots and 26% of my points. Total of 417 goals

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The reason you and Raph have the records are because you are scoring a lot of goals while having one guy produce a large amount of those points. At 26%, I don't even come close to your GDL13 Klima despite me scoring 19-24 more goals.

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Brutus    45

To me, ALL of the GDL stats are padded by the fact that you had 24 coaches playing an even amount of games against each other, while the vast majority of the stats are versus a completely inferior opponent, as GDL was nowhere near 24 competitive coaches for a long time.

So, if you decide to run 8 plus goals in a game vs lower opponent(s), you can decide who scores those goals much easier than if you do it vs similar talent, so Plabax's points about Shots On Goal are very relevant.  This easily explains how the top scorer for all the strong scoring coaches have a guy towards the top of scoring each season even if they don't have an elite player on their squad.   The stats come regardless because of abuse on B level players.

Anyhow, pointing to the GDL records as proof a player is better/worse to me is then flawed logic because the data is corrupted.  BUT, that said:

 

I believe FPB can run up the score just using JR/one type of guy even vs A guys.  Maybe not at the SAME clip, but the way he plays works vs A, A-, B players, and it is heavily dependent on ONE STUD.  The better the stud, the better his results.

I do agree Plabax could put up the same type of scoring by using just one player when he played the lower level players, but would fail to run up the scores when he played A level players, imo. 

In Classic, many years ago, I was Chicago and beat Plabax, who had his Rangers, and had touted them as the best team to use.  HE was goal chasing for records, and needed to maintain an average for his season predictions to come true.  He not only failed to run up the score on me, but he LOST more than once to me, which sent him into an epic meltdown where he quit the season after quitting mid-game.  BUT, the point was he knew he needed to abuse me, a B level player, in order to reach those goals, because he couldn't make up the ground vs an A opponent.

It made quitting easier for him because he did the math and knew it was over, even with half a season left.

If it were all A, I think Raph could possibly still maitain some scoring average, but would lose a lot of games.  I think FPB would do it and still win (as he always does), and I think Plabax could not.  However, I still would put money on Plabax to win most leagues he joins.  Kids true game (lag switch or not), is still SICK!

 

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Brutus    45

Also, I truly believe this:

 

Best player is based on how you play the game.  There is no vacuum where you can say, all 6's are better than all 5's.  Each of the players have something the other doesn't, and are missing something the other's aren't.

JR is extra light but nails all the check mars after that.
Bure has 5/6 skating, not 6/6, and is light w/ a 4 shot.
Mogs has 6/6 skating, is heavier and has the 4 shot. 
Yzer has 6/5 skating, is light but has 4 shot.
Gartner has accuracy issues, but hits all the other variables, including not being too light, so for the right guy, his player is highly coveted.
Klima has the 4 shot, but has all the numbers with it, perfect weight/balance and the wonderfully goofy awareness ratings.

 

Light can be good or bad, but if you are talking about being dominant, being TOO light in the C/B era can be a detriment.

But, depends on how you play.  So, given that each coach plays a different way, I reject the notion that there exist one universal truth that this player has to be the best player because Plabax or FPB had the best results with them.

I personally find Bure/Mogs to be AWESOME because they are SO fast, the goalie drops down earlier, making manual GC harder to stop them.  As I use a lot of deke's, and would struggle at times vs elite GC, I found I scored with Bure or Mogs vs those coaches much easier than with a speed 5 guy.

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Premium    18

Well, I can run up the score, it's just not with one player. Out of Raph, FPB and myself, I think I am the best at scoring.

If I had Yzerman and FPB had JR, my team would outscore FPB's team but he would have way more points with JR than I would have with Yzerman. 

------------------------------------------------------

That season with NYR I was aiming for 300 goals. The record (set by me) is 275. Even with my performance against you, scoring-wise that season is still better than any season by any coach not named Plabax. I finished out that season and scored somewhere around 265 goals I think :D 

I wasn't running up the score with one player that year though. The only time I ran up the score with one player was in Blitz 09, and I won.

Edited by Premium

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 Do you not get that scoring with 1 player only is harder? And that giving up the draft picks to pick top 3 makes the rest of your team shittier? Hello? 

Me n Raph could score wayyyyy if we didn't force it to 1 guy... or used a switch :X

Edited by The Russian Rocket

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Premium    18

If that's how you see it then what can I say. You went from 420 goals in GDL15 to 337 in GDL16. 

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Premium    18

You can score "wayyyyy" more goals, yet you lose almost every season :D 

 

 

Edited by Premium

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