Former NHL City most deserving of a second chance?


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With all the talk of teams moving and being sold I thought this was fitting... Specially with the Phoenix debacle... though I have a feeling they're staying put, sadly

Which of the former NHL Cities deserves to have a team again the most? Me.. personally I think Winnipeg.. I mean they did truly love their jets and it kinda sucks that they were taken away from them the way they were.. and my second city would have to be Quebec.. I do miss the NOrdiques.. I have a Nords jersey somewhere..... bah

Anyways with Minnesota and Atlanta getting new teams why not give another former NHL city a team.. whether through moving or just expansion....

lets keep this discussion civil please!

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I'd suggest Toronto having a second team before going to any other city. They could easily support it.

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I'd suggest Toronto having a second team before going to any other city. They could easily support it.

I can actually agree to that one... Southern ONtario almost got the Coyotes... I remember reading that somewhere...

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Hamilton!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamilton_Tigers

That or Winnipeg (and I'm really glad Minnesota got a team back)

I'm kind of of the opinion that they should go back to 28 teams, though. So many teams missing the playoffs is a big attendance issue, I think. Nothing decreases interest like having nothing to hope for at the start of a season. I can't believe the baseball playoffs used to be just 4 teams! (and 8 still isn't enough when your team is in the same division as the Yankees and Red Sox)

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Hamilton!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamilton_Tigers

That or Winnipeg (and I'm really glad Minnesota got a team back)

I'm kind of of the opinion that they should go back to 28 teams, though. So many teams missing the playoffs is a big attendance issue, I think. Nothing decreases interest like having nothing to hope for at the start of a season. I can't believe the baseball playoffs used to be just 4 teams! (and 8 still isn't enough when your team is in the same division as the Yankees and Red Sox)

Eh believe me if they got rid of some teams it wouldn't be bad either.. lol Me and my dad used to joke about, well okay it was a serious convo mostly. Gettin rid of the teams like Floriday and Tampa and focusing on cities that can and will support hockey.. IE Canadian and northern US cities.. and build the NHL From there

Oh yea and also no more Gary Bettman.. I can't stand that guy.

I was also glad though when Minnesota got their second chance.. So glad to see a state that supports hockey so much.. have hockey again

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nhl will have 32 teams within 10 years.

At the rate they're goin I won't argue....

A team in Seattle wouldn't be bad I guess.. But Quebec or Winnipeg gettin another look would be cool.. Those poor people in Winnipeg... losin their team to Phoenix of all places.. No offense if there are any Coyote fans on this board....

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At the rate they're goin I won't argue....

A team in Seattle wouldn't be bad I guess.. But Quebec or Winnipeg gettin another look would be cool.. Those poor people in Winnipeg... losin their team to Phoenix of all places.. No offense if there are any Coyote fans on this board....

Personally, I would like to see the Nords in Quebec again. I would definitely try to go to a game every season. Quebec City is a pretty cool place.

Edited by Bob Kudelski
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Personally, I would like to see the Nords in Quebec again. I would definitely try to go to a game every season. Quebec City is a pretty cool place.

Oh I agree, I would love to see a team back there.. Canada deserves more teams it's their game isn't it?

Why the hell are there teams in the American south where most people don't really give a damn? I guess that's another rant for another thread so I'll stop there before I get goin and insult anyones team!

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  • 3 weeks later...

I think Phoenix are also deserving to have their team back - they've been largely forgotten since they were in Glendale, downtown is slowly becoming an entertainment center again, and Phoenix's downtown is indeed centrally located. However, this has a snowball's chance in Phoenix of happening, and it wouldn't make many more people care (the Suns are top dog amongst long time locals because they've been there the longest, the D-Backs do fine when they're winning and the Cardinals are, well, an NFL team that doesn't suck anymore - but again, it's a lot easier for some people to drive 40-50 miles crosstown on a Sunday morning than it is on a Tuesday evening). Thing is, they didn't make any money in the old arena, either, but the visibility sure helped.

The damndest thing though, my first hockey game ever was Canadiens-Nordiques, and I've never been to Quebec (they played a game in Phoenix; I don't know if it was exhibition or regular season, but I think it led me to getting NHL 95 PC for xmas one year.)

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I think Phoenix are also deserving to have their team back - they've been largely forgotten since they were in Glendale, downtown is slowly becoming an entertainment center again, and Phoenix's downtown is indeed centrally located. However, this has a snowball's chance in Phoenix of happening, and it wouldn't make many more people care (the Suns are top dog amongst long time locals because they've been there the longest, the D-Backs do fine when they're winning and the Cardinals are, well, an NFL team that doesn't suck anymore - but again, it's a lot easier for some people to drive 40-50 miles crosstown on a Sunday morning than it is on a Tuesday evening). Thing is, they didn't make any money in the old arena, either, but the visibility sure helped.

The damndest thing though, my first hockey game ever was Canadiens-Nordiques, and I've never been to Quebec (they played a game in Phoenix; I don't know if it was exhibition or regular season, but I think it led me to getting NHL 95 PC for xmas one year.)

Err... Can you hear me, Mayor Statto? Don't the Coyotes count? It's not like they're gonna relocated them again, will they?

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Err... Can you hear me, Mayor Statto? Don't the Coyotes count? It's not like they're gonna relocated them again, will they?

Naw, they're probably not going anywhere. Not if the NHL have their way and work against how the world works, keeping something around which loses money. At least in downtown Phoenix the yotes would have a chance to generate some buzz.

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Hartford, Quebec and Winnipeg all deserve teams.

"deserves"

Kind of how people say the Saints deserve a Super Bowl title. I am not sure any city is deserving of anything in pro sports, but rather it is earned. Winnipeg lost it's team to Phoenix..... discuss

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"deserves"

Kind of how people say the Saints deserve a Super Bowl title. I am not sure any city is deserving of anything in pro sports, but rather it is earned. Winnipeg lost it's team to Phoenix..... discuss

Discuss? There is nothing to discuss. They didn't "lose" their team to Phoenix. Bettman was bat-crazy about expanding to non-hockey territories; furthermore, ownership of some teams were too cheap to provide any funding for the new arenas they needed. This is what led those cities to "lose" their teams. Look no further than the Hartford Whalers! Their owner was a sleazebag on par with Art Modell or Al Davis. He saw a free arena and jumped at the first opportunity to head there (leaving a loyal fan base behind in the process).

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I'll also add that I don't give a crap how big any particular city's population is. I'd rather go to a town of 20,000 people (of which 17,000 are hockey fans) than to go to a town of 120,000 people (and only 4,000 of which are hockey fans). It's called COMMON SENSE (which Bettman and some owners are severely lacking in).

Most southern markets are terrible for hockey (Dallas has been the exception to that rule). If the NHL is going to continue to expand, then they ought to expand to places where people care about hockey and will attend hockey games. Put a team back in Hartford again! Put a team in Maine, in one of the Dakotas, in Wisconsin, etc. The last thing we need is a team in Podunk or Alburquerque.

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some truth for you:

Whalers attendance last 3 years of existence: 11,822 11,967 13,680

Hurricanes attendance last 3 years: 17,386 16,663 16,572

Oh... but there's more:

Jet's attendance last 3 years of existence: 13,297 13,013 11,316

Coyotes attendance last 3 years: 14,988 14,820 14,875

I don't even need to do Quebec and Colorado.

I think people have a rosy vision of the past when they claim Winnipeg, Hartford, and Quebec "deserve" NHL teams. It seems these Southern teams are doing a better job of attracting fans. Putting a team in Maine or the Dakotas is business suicide. Just because a place is cold doesn't mean it can better handle a pro sports franchise. I hope you are ready to discuss now:)

statistics from http://www.andrewsstarspage.com/index.php/..._90/118-2008-09

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Here's some more truth for you: hockey was less popular back then as opposed to now. If those same southern markets had NHL teams BACK THEN, their attendance numbers would have been even lower than those previous markets were at that time.

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Here's some more truth for you: hockey was less popular back then as opposed to now. If those same southern markets had NHL teams BACK THEN, their attendance numbers would have been even lower than those previous markets were at that time.

truth: let it go man. There is a reason those locations don't have franchises right now. It makes more sense for Toronto to have a 2nd team than any of those 3 locations to have a team.

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truth: let it go man. There is a reason those locations don't have franchises right now. It makes more sense for Toronto to have a 2nd team than any of those 3 locations to have a team.

Truth: I never said those locations deserve a team more than Toronto deserves a 2nd team. Let go of your delusions, man.

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Truth: I never said those locations deserve a team more than Toronto deserves a 2nd team. Let go of your delusions, man.

I am already liking this conversation.

I just decided to supply people with logic when it comes to the discussion of what city "deserves" an NHL team in the event that Phoenix or Atlanta (or any team in Florida?) relocates. The numbers don't support the 3 locations you've cited..

I apologize for my delusions. I'd love to continue this conversation in an educated manner, as I feel it lends itself to such a conversation.

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I am already liking this conversation.

I just decided to supply people with logic when it comes to the discussion of what city "deserves" an NHL team in the event that Phoenix or Atlanta (or any team in Florida?) relocates. The numbers don't support the 3 locations you've cited..

I apologize for my delusions. I'd love to continue this conversation in an educated manner, as I feel it lends itself to such a conversation.

Keep in mind that the topic is about FORMER NHL cities. That is the context in which my responses were made. As for my suggestions of Hartford and the like; they would be better hockey markets than Nashville, Atlanta, and Phoenix! Would they be better than a 2nd Toronto team? Maybe, maybe not. Dallas has been the exception to the "Me love football and hate hockey!" rule in the south.

If there is expansion in the future, I'd rather see the expansion head to hockey towns like Wisconsin, Maine, the Dakotas, and provinces in Canada.

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The lot of these franchises hemorrhaged so much red ink they had to serve beer in bags. Who cares it's only money, prosperous clubs can carry the water. So why not.....

Idaho Youdahoe's: 3 goals for a potato trick.

Or the Arkansas Dohickey's: armor piercing bobble head night. Fun for the whole family!

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Matt: Huh? 15 000? Did you check the price? Did you steal the NHL's numbers?

The actual PAID tickets turn around 12 000. Get your facts straight. Giveaways don't count as income, especially if they don't come to the game.

http://www.fromtherink.com/2009/6/3/897211...endance-figures

+ It's quite a difference when your arena can have 18 000 and the Nords or Jets could take 14 500 or less.

And counting the last year of a franchise, or dates after the announcement of a moving is bullshit. Can't fill an arena with people you announced to you were taking theyr team away.

Edited by The Russian Rocket
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Matt: Huh? 15 000? Did you check the price? Did you steal the NHL's numbers?

The actual PAID tickets turn around 12 000. Get your facts straight. Giveaways don't count as income, especially if they don't come to the game.

http://www.fromtherink.com/2009/6/3/897211...endance-figures

+ It's quite a difference when your arena can have 18 000 and the Nords or Jets could take 14 500 or less.

And counting the last year of a franchise, or dates after the announcement of a moving is bullshit. Can't fill an arena with people you announced to you were taking theyr team away.

Very sleuthy.... I am curious where data like this for all NHL teams can be seen, instead of random blogs around the internet? It would be imprudent to make your statements based only on the Coyotes, when similar data may exist for the Jets in their last year.

to extend this argument, paid tickets do not represent total income. TV attendance is a big part of it, and is a reason why TruePenFans wish of the Dakotas or Maine getting a hockey team will never happen. Everyone has a peachy view of Quebec and Winnipeg packing arenas and being profitable, but if that were the case why did the owners bail?

I would discredit your argument that people won't come if you are taking away a franchise, I would think people would come to get a last chance to see them. Tit for tat:)

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Everyone has a peachy view of Quebec and Winnipeg packing arenas and being profitable, but if that were the case why did the owners bail?

My guess:

post-2349-1265648574_thumb.png

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