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Congratulations AJ!


Uncle Seth
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Lag is in the game when you play online. IMO.

Maybe my own fault, for having bad internet, I don't know, but it is a different game online with a constant degree of lag.

Main reason I don't like playing online, though I am in no way claiming that it has an effect on my W-L.

Even on an Original System with a HDTV, you get some lag.

CRT TV's and Original System = No Lag.

Edited by CoachMac
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It has been four days since someone posted in this thread, but it is too juicy to leave alone!!

One thing I am wondering is, say we did have recorded video of the play in question? That would tell us which eye witness account is closer to how they have been described, true. So public support would either be for AJ (if "it was a money goal" is confirmed) or Seth (if "the goal was greatly helped by lag"), BUT!

According to the letter of the law, the fact is a goal is a goal, right?

So even though we would have our "ethical" answer about who's version of events is closer to the truth, we already have our official answer: goals stand, even when caused/influenced by lag. Right?

Or, perhaps Kingraph or a commish in general, would actually make some sort of "good faith" ruling when there is video evidence? (Not so much in this case, since things moved on, but in future cases, when there is video evidence?) Or is the bottom line always a goal is a goal is a goal, short of complete desync?

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A goal is a goal, there will never be a ruling on a goal. You can choose to play with some gentlemen's rules on penalty shots, goalie locks, after whistle goals, etc. See the etiquette guide for some guidelines, but that doesn't mean you or your opponent HAVE to play that way.

Someone can (and sometimes will) always complain about a lag spike. It sucks and nearly always disrupts the game in some way. And in this case, a big way. Not just because the result was a goal, but because Seth lost his mind after the goal and couldn't recover mentally. And playoff '94 requires a lot of mental focus.

So the end result is AJ wins the series 4 games to 1, no questions. The only debate is whether AJ was justified in keeping his go-ahead goal as he was going to score on the play anyway, OR, did he get a freebie because Seth definitely would have saved the goal (using the defensemen) if it weren't for the lag spike that threw off his timing? OR, should AJ give up the goal regardless because Seth made a claim and he wouldn't have done so if it wasn't legit. Who knows? There is no right answer.

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A goal is a goal, there will never be a ruling on a goal. You can choose to play with some gentlemen's rules on penalty shots, goalie locks, after whistle goals, etc. See the etiquette guide for some guidelines, but that doesn't mean you or your opponent HAVE to play that way.

Someone can (and sometimes will) always complain about a lag spike. It sucks and nearly always disrupts the game in some way. And in this case, a big way. Not just because the result was a goal, but because Seth lost his mind after the goal and couldn't recover mentally. And playoff '94 requires a lot of mental focus.

So the end result is AJ wins the series 4 games to 1, no questions. The only debate is whether AJ was justified in keeping his go-ahead goal as he was going to score on the play anyway, OR, did he get a freebie because Seth definitely would have saved the goal (using the defensemen) if it weren't for the lag spike that threw off his timing? OR, should AJ give up the goal regardless because Seth made a claim and he wouldn't have done so if it wasn't legit. Who knows? There is no right answer.

I personally think there should be a rule about the after whistle goal, and a rule that regardless if he game whistles it dead during a PS that if puck is poke checked, or player bumps goalie AND only if player looses control of puck after bump you should no longer be allowed to pursue the PS even if the whistle does no blow, and still time on shot clock, just my opinion thou.

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I personally think there should be a rule about the after whistle goal, and a rule that regardless if he game whistles it dead during a PS that if puck is poke checked, or player bumps goalie AND only if player looses control of puck after bump you should no longer be allowed to pursue the PS even if the whistle does no blow, and still time on shot clock, just my opinion thou.

I agree. It blows my mind every time that people will look to cheat their way to victory.

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I personally think there should be a rule about the after whistle goal, and a rule that regardless if he game whistles it dead during a PS that if puck is poke checked, or player bumps goalie AND only if player looses control of puck after bump you should no longer be allowed to pursue the PS even if the whistle does no blow, and still time on shot clock, just my opinion thou.

And I disagree. At least for the penalty shot bit.

Being able to take a shot after a poke check, or skate around in circles, yada, yada is not part of the NHL's rules, but it is part of the "Arcade Style" hockey game called NHL94.

A glitch is one thing, but this is no glitch. It is built into the game.

(By coincidence I posted on this same topic an hour ago in another thread.)

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One very important point is still a mystery here. Seth claims that not once during the discussion/argument that happened right after the goal did AJ bring up the fact that it was a 'money goal'. Seth says that AJ changed his tune about the goal from initially calling it a 'good opportunity' (not an actual quote but something along those lines), and then a 'money goal' only after this thread was made.

So, is this true AJ?

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I just think Seth should have taken a goal if it was offered from AJ at that moment, instead of getting all butt hurt about him not wanting to give it to him.

Once you pause a game for more than 30 seconds, all previous conversations are off, imo.

Once a game CRASHES cause you paused it so long, I'm definitely not going to give it to you.

Still, I see Seth's point on the goal, just don't see why he's waiting for Raph. I mean, it's a goal. It's legal. What's Raph going to say? AJ's being a b-hole. He SHOULD give the goal, so take the offered goal Seth??

Still confusing to me.

Plus, AJ was LA. Seth was Quebec. Nothing in the play before or after seemed to predict a Seth win, so to not somehow acknowledge that on here also ignores the biggest reality.

So, in my conclusion, Seth is a whiny, sore loser and AJ is a cut throat winner, but clearly the winner either way.

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Seth argued and discussed for 10 minutes with AJ and got nowhere. It's the first time that Seth has ever asked for a goal back so it was quite obviously some massive cheesy lag. If I legitimately felt like the goal was fake and was asking for a goal, and got denied in cold blood after 10 minutes of arguing, then I wouldn't wanna accept the offer either. Like plabax said, it's more about the principle of the matter after you've argued for 10 whole minutes.

Yes asking Raph was a mistake, but whatever.

Nothing in the play before seemed to predict a Seth win? Seth was down 2-1 in the series, tied 5-5 late in game 4. That's anybody's freaking series. You pointed out the matchup, but it seems to me more the opposite. Of course AJ doesn't wanna lose to Quebec, so maybe that played a role in why he fought so hard to keep such a controversial goal.

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The impression AJ gave is he offered the goal, but Seth waited so long for Raph that the game crashed.

I'm sure AJ didn't offer it at first, but I did not get the impression from AJ he waited 10 minutes to offer the goal. IF he waited that long to concede giving the goal, then his point about the game crashing cause of waiting for Raph would not be very valid.

I think both guys have stopped posting about it, so it's probably not getting answered. But, I've asked why Seth didn't accept the goal when offered, but that's gone unanswered.

Also, 2 games to 1 game, and you are tied 5-5 and lose the next game as well, so it's 3-1 plus a 5-5 tie in a series you are the heavy underdog because you have the inferior team. Or Seth needs the excuse of being tilt after losing to AJ in game 4 on the controversy to make the claim it's a close series???

Come on. Seth loses to AJ in that series every time. All the rest is "I like Seth" & "I hate AJ" mantra garbage.

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And also, I've hardly ever spoken with AJ in my time on this site. Played vs him in all my games and always considered him a guy willing to take any angle to win. Knew it up front. He's cut throat. He's holding me, grabbing, kicking, biting, whatever.

But solid dude and was at Toronto King of '94 and lived up to his billing.

Seth has long been an online buddy of mine, and I've played 1,000 of games with him. He too plays very cheap taking every possible goal, dumping pucks constantly, whatever it takes to win. He skates backwards on penalty shots until I can't see where my goalie might be and then takes a running start at the net. BUT, I 1000% would never expect Seth to try for a lag goal. He is WAY MORE on that "up & up" type level about lag. He's definitely got more of the same Plabax line of "honor" goals, etc. However, he takes enough cheap goals vs me I'm stunned he is crying about another guy doing something.

I just strongly disagree w/ being a sore loser in a finals series on the forum and even more disagree w/ pausing a game that long over a lag goal, and can clearly see some anti-AJ in most of the anti-AJ points.

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I like AJ man. Of course I have a little bit of Seth bias, but I respect AJ as a competitor and for all his efforts on this site throughout the years.

He just seems awfully smug in all his posts in this thread, and it seems kinda fishy.

Talk about anti-AJ stuff Brutus, you came out of left field in this thread on day 1 being as anti-fking-seth as possible lol.

WE WANT ANSWERS, RESPOND TO THIS THREAD SETH AND AJ

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Yeah, I've been hard on Seth on this one.

But it's the finals & it's ok to not post congrats cause you are sour , or to take it to aim to call soneone out cause that's what aim is for!!

Posting in the forum this way if it were game 7 & you feel it's why you lost? Maybe.

Lost 4-1 & got only one goal in question??

That's highly suspect at best. So yeah, I felt strongly against Sethrr about that.

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4-1 is misleading as TK pointed out. 2-1 and tied 5-5 is anyone's series. If you feel you got jobbed then it's pretty easy to get steamrolled the next game.

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I like AJ man. Of course I have a little bit of Seth bias, but I respect AJ as a competitor and for all his efforts on this site throughout the years.

He just seems awfully smug in all his posts in this thread, and it seems kinda fishy.

Talk about anti-AJ stuff Brutus, you came out of left field in this thread on day 1 being as anti-fking-seth as possible lol.

WE WANT ANSWERS, RESPOND TO THIS THREAD SETH AND AJ

I've said everything i had to say. if you want to think im being smug or fishy then thats really your problem that you cant remove bias from the situation. you guys can speculate all you want but im not going to waste my time or my words explaining a situation I've already explained when your emotional decision has already been made.

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Really more than anything else - there needs to be a decision made here going forward. Either a rule voted on a put in place, or perhaps just a reminder before the play-offs start so that both players KNOW what to expect from their opponent.

Maybe before the playoff series begins, you run through the check-list and decide how you both want to proceed in these uncommon situations.

Pausing the game and calling/texting/PM for a ruling does a few unwanted things:

1. gives a player a free time-out

2. takes momentum away from the opponent (not in game but in terms of focus)

3. increases the chances of a desync (which has it's own ramifications, including a reset of player abilities in the new game)

Not pointing fingers here, because I think both guys are great competitors - just stating that with a firm ruling (even if it boils down to a gentleman's agreement between players) all of these feelings of being cheated, or of poor sportsmanship are no longer a topic in the forums.

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