Spring'16 Playoff Scenarios


Recommended Posts

Oh, and the only reason the season is being extended is because the end fell on a holiday weekend. Most people take vacation during Memorial Day. So 2 extra days were thrown on the end of it. Big deal.

That was planned and known since the start of the season. As for Snes I didn't ask for it, neither should I receive it.

Link to post
Share on other sites

For whatever reason things are really coming to a head with people being fed up with slackers. First Coach, now FPB are saying they are done participating. (I am assuming this is what Coach is saying, based on his last post here, him quitting the Classic AIM group, and a terse AIM we exchanged.)

Thing is, this means we are losing guys that DO NOT miss games, in favor of people that DO miss games. Which, I think most would agree, is the opposite of what is good for the community?

I would suggest that we:

1. Say from now on a deadline is final

2. Take a hard line on people that have slacked off for next GDL and Classic (i.e. ban those that slacked)

3. Ask FPB, Coach and any other good participators that ar fed up to re-consider in view of points 1 & 2

I think most of the good contributors, like FPB and Coach, would be fine if the group size is smaller, as long as all participants are dedicated. I know that is the case for me. (I am new-ish, but have always hit 100% completion.)

Link to post
Share on other sites

The main problem is multiple leagues running at once. Maybe there should be a limit to the number of leagues people can sign up for. There are 3 leagues running at the same time right now (though this doesn't excuse SNES for slacking).

I agree with the deadline being final. From now on that is what it will be.

Ban those that slack? Sure, I have no problem with that. How many people will we have per league? There are also a number of guys this season who don't normally slack in Fall. Should we punish them? Spring always has a low turnout, bad percentage of games played. Maybe we will just forget Spring Classic, and stick with only Fall. Maybe people will be more interested in it then.

Also remember, Classic is the largest league that is run. Tough to get 100% completion with a large group of guys. How do other online sports game leagues fare with completion percentage? I'm curious.

The smaller leagues should have no excuse for slackers. There should be plenty of replacements waiting for them.

Looks like Tecmo suffered similar issues with game participation - http://tecmobowl.org/forum/topic/68343-current-state-of-online-tecmo/

I'm all for ideas folks. We tried a different thing this season with limiting the amount of teams in each league. We thought we'd get a better turnout than we did. We could have had guys on the Waiting List and could have been more strict, but it didn't turn out that way. Spring Classic has just had less and less participation each season.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The main problem is multiple leagues running at once. Maybe there should be a limit to the number of leagues people can sign up for. There are 3 leagues running at the same time right now (though this doesn't excuse SNES for slacking).

I agree with the deadline being final. From now on that is what it will be.

Ban those that slack? Sure, I have no problem with that. How many people will we have per league? There are also a number of guys this season who don't normally slack in Fall. Should we punish them? Spring always has a low turnout, bad percentage of games played. Maybe we will just forget Spring Classic, and stick with only Fall. Maybe people will be more interested in it then.

Also remember, Classic is the largest league that is run. Tough to get 100% completion with a large group of guys. How do other online sports game leagues fare with completion percentage? I'm curious.

The smaller leagues should have no excuse for slackers. There should be plenty of replacements waiting for them.

Looks like Tecmo suffered similar issues with game participation - http://tecmobowl.org/forum/topic/68343-current-state-of-online-tecmo/

I'm all for ideas folks. We tried a different thing this season with limiting the amount of teams in each league. We thought we'd get a better turnout than we did. We could have had guys on the Waiting List and could have been more strict, but it didn't turn out that way. Spring Classic has just had less and less participation each season.

If you never do anything to people who slack, it gives those low in the standings no incentive to finish their games.

Also continues to breed the toxic slacking culture. Right now in Gens I played 30 games in my 1st week, been waiting next 5 for the same 2 players, because I couldn't be online the only week they play I'm getting the same ammount of penalty.

GDL has some good ideas: Punish repeat offenders and reward those who move the sticks early.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I wasted my time and took about 7-8 losses because I was rushing to get some games in and had to play on my laptop. The extension is wasting the time of those who took the time to FOLLOW the rules. Yeah some people may be busy, but does NOBODY ever think that busy people MAKE time to fit games in before the deadline? f**k.

Tecmo Bowl guys have 28-man leagues and get 100% games played in same season length. This is bullshit.

Guys like Voc aren't busy, they just don't give a f**k because they'll get an extension.

Edited by Premium
Link to post
Share on other sites

Bump -- reminder season ends June 1st (somewhere in the middle of the night)!

I can surely understand the frustration of folks who made the effort to get their games in on time, seems like we are rewarding slackers. I am keeping a closer eye on this and while Classic has always been "open to all", I will change that come Fall. Hopefully the 2 extra days allows guys to play, but shouldn't be a big deal in the grand scheme of things.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Classic has never been tight on "ending a season", and slackers getting punished. I'm not sure WHY NOW it's such a big deal, other than Classic A went to a smaller group and VC, Carse & Zep make that stand out so much more since they are 10% of your games.

Tons of noise, but really, there are NOT that many players to "pool" from, and a fair share of them come & go. The hero one season is the slacker the next.

If you want to play NHL94 ONLINE & in a LEAGUE, not a small little group of 4-6 players, you can COUNT on issues getting your games in.

I work a TON of hours, have 5 kids & spend time with them all, and still find to the gym and watch a decent amount of my TV thanks to DVR, and still finish 98% of my games in all my leagues, regardless of how many I'm in.

The difference, IS I ALWAYS schedule my time to make sure I fit a 45 minute window for 2-3 games of league play. So, on a given night, I realize I can't goto the gym if I hadn't played any NHL94 league games in a 3-4 days and someone has taken the time to let me know they will be on that night. I reschedule the gym for the next night on my personal life and grab the opportunity for NHL94 when it comes.

Another example, Probob told everyone last night via AIM, he would be on AFTER midnight. Beavers WAITED till after midnight. Probob did not show. This type of sh&t is why a Probob is low on games. Guys WILL NOT sacrifice their time to fit your schedule if you don't show the respect and make sacrifices too. Of course, Probob probably said that 4-5 times and showed up and midnight with noone around, so he might not have thought it was going to matter. Maybe Beavers sends a PM? to Probob letting him know he is on waiting type thing.

In the end, even in smaller leagues, or with only ONE league running, we have the SAME CONVERSATIONS OVER & OVER. So, this time we had 3 leagues running. Same complaints as before, BUT 3 times the number of complaints BECAUSE!!! there were 3 leagues running, which increased the complaints 3 times.

ON THE SNES LEAGUE, with only ONE league RUNNING, BAM!, LOWEST GAMES PLAYED BY MILES & MILES & MILES.

So, don't tell me it's cause too many leagues. It's the same old same old ALWAYS. Maybe 20-25 coaches playing a 20 year old game at any given time, and maybe 15 of them play around 8-11 pm eastern, the rest sparse around. That's not a formula for 100% games under ANY setup.

Link to post
Share on other sites

FYI, NO ONE wants to play in a 4-5 coach league, or we'd have tons of them running all the time.

We all want the big leagues with the big drafts, etc. And the elite players want the top competition, etc., so it's more challenging for them.

etc, etc.

No good solutions. Stop acting like there is one.

Be happy we have leagues to play in and some kind of organization. Appreciate the efforts by Chaos & Raph to help. Despite the other's rants, I would really like to say thanks for having me in Classic, and I enjoyed losing all my games in A, despite being close.

Look forward to a strong finish for GDL.

Link to post
Share on other sites

There HAS to be a good solution out there. We just haven't found it yet. I believe the best way is to copy what Tecmo does because theirs WORKS. If we take something that works then it shouldn't fail.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I think things can be improved, and welcome suggestions here:

http://forum.nhl94.com/index.php/topic/17584-random-ideas-for-stopping-slackers/

I thought by making a "Suggestion Thread" good ideas wouldn't get lost in a sea of rants and belly-aching.

Link to post
Share on other sites

In GDL, this season, we have 2 of our bigger "slackers" as Probob & VocallyCaged.

Last season, they were the "heroes" that were replacement coaches who filled in for two other previously reliable coaches in Depch & Wallywojo, and got their games in.

And we needed FPB to replace a long time vet in EA in a short notice and that even got criticism because I let him be playoff eligible with a week left in the season at the switch.

So, this year, Labs, Sicarius, Probob, BOK, & VC are making getting to 56 games seem like a work.

I replaced BOK w/ Sebe, a vet similar to FPB that had been out of the loop. He's managed to play only a handful of games.

To me, I don't think ANY FORMAT is going to stop these problems from having popped up, nor the solution so much more apparent in these instances. The current wait list for GDL is ALL B level players, or A guys you can't rely on.

Good luck filling in the blanks. I'm just happy we still have the league running, have some fun, have good playoffs, and to me, THE ONLY KILLER, is if the playoffs are allowed to DRAG on and stop future seasons, momentum till finals, etc.

Either way, I don't run the other leagues, and don't want to. GDL gets enough kudos and will continue at a 3 season's per year if I can keep it going.

Link to post
Share on other sites

^

True BUT the difference is that Sebe is trying. I see him on asking for games at night, only to find the guys he's looking for are MIA. Whereas BoK just didn't give a s**t so he wouldnt be on much at all.

Edited by Uncle Seth
Link to post
Share on other sites

^

True BUT the difference is that Sebe is trying. I see him on asking for games at night, only to find the guys he's looking for are MIA. Whereas BoK just didn't give a s**t so he wouldnt be on much at all.

In the end though, if the result is the same, and let's say BOK is better at with 3 days left, logging on and playing 20 games, despite the inconvenience to all of us, if BOK logs more games in the end, I might have "hurt" the league's overall completion percentages with this "switch".

I do think that by replacing BOK, I did then motivate the others at the bottom to "giddy up", and think even if Sebe doesn't get to 56 games, we as a league will have better completion percentage.

But, we are NOT going to get to 100% this time around. I don't see it. We will however, have a scheduled playoffs, and scheduled start of the new season/draft & I think that makes it all worth plowing through the rest of the "crap".

Link to post
Share on other sites

It would be nice to have a no tolerance policy for slackers, and maybe you can do it in Gens, but there aren't enough active SNES players to be able to just ban people who don't get their games in.

More communication would be great. Maybe you make everyone give out their phone number at the start of the league. Maybe everyone gets in a WhatsApp group (I know for me, AIM on mobile isn't a great solution).

I lean more in that direction than just booting people. We need more activity, not less, but I don't know how to engage or re-engage the people we do have.

Link to post
Share on other sites

It would be nice to have a no tolerance policy for slackers, and maybe you can do it in Gens, but there aren't enough active SNES players to be able to just ban people who don't get their games in.

More communication would be great. Maybe you make everyone give out their phone number at the start of the league. Maybe everyone gets in a WhatsApp group (I know for me, AIM on mobile isn't a great solution).

I lean more in that direction than just booting people. We need more activity, not less, but I don't know how to engage or re-engage the people we do have.

In GDL, I require a cell phone in order for me to communicate with the players. Guys without cell phones were made exceptions for, plus Plabax, but he was under age, so I didn't really want his mom or dad calling me up and asking me why I kept texting their son. lol, plus the 3 guys without cell phones were the 3 of the best at games played (Seth, FPB & Plabax).

During the drafts, IT WAS A HUGE HELP!!!

For game play, it does have to be able to reach out to guy and get their attention, as we know, AIM is not the best route to get someone's attention more times than not.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The fact that AIM app on mobile is not available in Canada really messes a lot of communication for those in Canada while us guys in the states can communicate on AIM from anywhere, anytime we please.

Maybe moving away from AIM for communication to something that is more accessible for both US, Canadians, and other countries.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The fact that AIM app on mobile is not available in Canada really messes a lot of communication for those in Canada while us guys in the states can communicate on AIM from anywhere, anytime we please.

Maybe moving away from AIM for communication to something that is more accessible for both US, Canadians, and other countries.

Actually, Canadian's can use the App, it is just not easy to download. I will dig up a link Atomic Raven sent me and add it to a suitable thread.

Also, I used to think AIM was total crap because I couldn't login. But I googled and found out if you uncheck save password, and retype your password when you login, it works 99% of the time (for me)....

Bottom line is AIM is only a medium-sized turd, not the humongous steaming pile I thought at first.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Congrats to c4, AJ, and XCing for 40 games played bud. Well done.

XCing gets the additional shoutout for putting up a huge 33-7 season! Killer. Now just to see how the playoff matchups crystallize after tonight.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Updated as of 1am. Unless there are games played LATE tonight, this should be it.

Note, for GENS B, I didn't take DNP for games vs Sicarius ( :(, dissapointed ), so Beavers gets the 4th seed and bye. Otherwise doesn't affect the rest.

For GENS A, some issue with FPB not wanting to play Zeppelin, so also didn't take DNP from Zepp for those games. Overall, playoffs look correct, thanks for banging out these games these last few days. Nearly 100% completion with the exception of the two I noted above!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ohhh the chips did not fall favourably for me, 4th seed, first round match against stheds and Boston. Potential semifinal against the top seed.

Dodging Kudelski and AJ unless I go to the final at least.

Let's do it boys!

Link to post
Share on other sites

KingRaph sent me a PM asking me to clarify my post and if I was quitting classic in protest of the 2 day extension.

I could care less about the 2 day extension. It is all the other BS (quitters, slackers, etc...)

Short Answer is No, I will finish my commitment. At the time I saw no way I would make playoffs and was just saying bye.

Long Answer. OrangeandBlack always quits. Why is he ever let in a league. Mav same thing but he remains #1 on GDL waitlist. Lots of others I could list, but I am sure I will get some sob story or angry reply from those 2 so I won't kick anymore bees nest than that.

Not sure why drafting and signing up is so popular, but it bugs me.

Small leagues make sense. Really "A" comes down to AJ, Raph, Seth, Plabax, Zalex, CF66, Ice, FPB maybe somebody else. I would love to see a small 6 to 8 team leagues that were competitive instead of those guys running it up on the rest of you losers. Plus those guys play their games and could knock off tons of seasons and to me have much more fun. Kind of like why Alabama needs to play UT Chattanogga. Just play LSU and Auburn. But I know it is about money and running up big stats.

Ultimate League to me right now would be using my Original 6 WT BUG FIX C/B FiX rom

KingRaph, Plabax, Seth, AngryJay, FPB, Zalex

40 games play each other 8 times.

Best Players, Lots of Rivalries, Lots of Hate.

Aqua, Jer33, and I are the start of an excellent B/C or maybe Z league.

OK wait I will kick one more bees nest, but hopefully he knows it is not personal.

I would love to also mention Labs66 in this group, BUT......

LABS66 is a great guy. One of my favorites on this site. But it is always a last minute rush to play 20 games on the last day. Drives me nuts.

And if you want to play the better A players you can exi them.

Raph, Chaos, Halifax do a great job managing this madness. I am just not sure why they deal with what they deal with.

Small Leagues with Similar Skilled Players that play their games make sense.

Short fast leagues make sense.

At least 20 games per week is what I would be looking for. Maybe organize people by that.

I love the idea of a set schedule, (like Wednesday Nights at 11 eastern) but I know it would never work.

Ba55i5t, let me know when you can play our series as I do not intend to sit around waiting for you to show up on AIM.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Raph, Chaos, Halifax do a great job managing this madness. I am just not sure why they deal with what they deal with.

The thing that drives me to run Classic each season is the hopes that for every piece of madness, there is a new player like ba55i5t, CK, DT, etc. No matter how good or bad they may be, that's my favorite part about Classic. New buds. Moreso in the Fall than Spring, but I always want to see the community grow.

Good point above, and let's just say the folks you mentioned won't be in Classic next season.

As far as top talent, this has been true for years, BUT it does change. If you look at the list 4 years ago, nobody is touching Frey, Carse, swos, and KGman. 2 years ago TomKabs emerges, Plabax is on top, and even I start to give the top guys a run for their money. Right now, it's they guys you mention. I hear rumblings that Carse and Freydey are returning, could be even crazier. I have never liked the 24 team GDL league, and have always argued for 12 and 12, like Blitz used to do. However, I have found other people DO like to play the top guys to try to improve their game...it's the only way it will happen.

Exis vs. A level guys is not always easy to find. I am happy to play anybody when I have time, but at the same time I understand from other guys, there's not much fun in beating up an opponent during an exi.

Anyway, all good stuff Coach, but this will be the nature of the beast until we double or triple our active community. Been saying that for 5 years, so don't hold your breath. Just breathe, relax, and play on! :)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Small leagues make sense. Really "A" comes down to AJ, Raph, Seth, Plabax, Zalex, CF66, Ice, FPB maybe somebody else. I would love to see a small 6 to 8 team leagues that were competitive instead of those guys running it up on the rest of you losers. Plus those guys play their games and could knock off tons of seasons and to me have much more fun. Kind of like why Alabama needs to play UT Chattanogga. Just play LSU and Auburn. But I know it is about money and running up big stats...

Ba55i5t, let me know when you can play our series as I do not intend to sit around waiting for you to show up on AIM.

CoachMac, it is hard to disagree with your sentiment, but when you say inflammatory statements like the one I have bolded and underlined above, this undermines what the '94 community is all about. Some of the players you cite came up through B leagues to become the players they are now. Like Raph rightly says:

The thing that drives me to run Classic each season is the hopes that for every piece of madness, there is a new player like ba55i5t, CK, DT, etc. No matter how good or bad they may be, that's my favorite part about Classic. New buds. Moreso in the Fall than Spring, but I always want to see the community grow.

As far as top talent, this has been true for years, BUT it does change. If you look at the list 4 years ago, nobody is touching Frey, Carse, swos, and KGman. 2 years ago TomKabs emerges, Plabax is on top, and even I start to give the top guys a run for their money. Right now, it's they guys you mention... However, I have found other people DO like to play the top guys to try to improve their game...it's the only way it will happen.

New buds. People that share a similar passion for a game that is today, a very niche audience. We're no 50,000 strong playing NHL 16. We're way less and still we get online and have leagues. In particular, I draw emphasis to the bolded and underlined statements, because I am one of those guys. I have just reached .500 on my all time record (from starting abysmally in VHL 1). Please do not scare off the "rest of us" because some of these guys are not as committed. Who knows what this community will look like a year from now? If we get 5 committed for every 50, I say that's damn good. Even 1 in 50. The key is to having those swift deadlines and exacting the penalties where they are due. We're always looking for players that can finish a season in a reasonable amount of time, and I would argue that regardless of skill level, dudes that want to play with the best should get that opportunity. I'm all for diversity in skill and upsets that happen maybe 1 in 100 times. In other words, give the committed guys a chance. I know I didn't get my '92 games in, but that is really the only fault I have so far.

I will be on AIM generally in afternoons EST, but can not see you in the group chat. I'm here now and will be ready to play until 8pm EST. If needed, message me on AIM (james.lannigan).

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey Bassist,

I hear what you are saying. I just think Coach has been here a long time, seeing the same problems and frustrations over and over, and is fed up.

And while "You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar", if you are nearing the point of leaving altogether, you probably don't care so much how you come off. (Especially to the guys that have "frustrated you"/"drove you away".)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah I don't disagree with the sentiment, need some s**t to get some players to grow.

However IMO some guys just shouldn't be allowed to play anymore, when they constantly prove they can't finish a league for s**t. It's not better to get a wider league if you have guys who have a 95% chance of just leaving like they always do.

Link to post
Share on other sites

You need to have other coaches destroy you before you can improve. I never improved until I got the chance to play in Raph's Survivor League and lost to every A player. That league was great and was definitely my favourite.

Link to post
Share on other sites

You need to have other coaches destroy you before you can improve. I never improved until I got the chance to play in Raph's Survivor League and lost to every A player. That league was great and was definitely my favourite.

This

I encourage the destruction when I play VS you destroyers, unfortunately I've yet to improve from it.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I've never had a problem meeting deadlines. I started all 3 leagues at the same time and finished them all, while working 60 hours a week and raising a kid. There truly is no excuse. You're either committed, or you're not. I am in favor of keeping the same formats, and just coming down MUCH harder on the slackers. Shouldn't even be any leeway. 2 missed deadlines and you're out.

Link to post
Share on other sites
instead of those guys running it up on the rest of you losers.

I was joking. Sorry if you misunderstood that.

Check my record.

There truly is no excuse. You're either committed, or you're not

Yup.

However IMO some guys just shouldn't be allowed to play anymore, when they constantly prove they can't finish a league for s**t. It's not better to get a wider league if you have guys who have a 95% chance of just leaving like they always do.

Yup.

You need to have other coaches destroy you before you can improve.

Yeah! I get it. I invite AngryJay93 to my house, buy him pizza and get my ass kicked like 20 times in a single night in person. I should not have even mentioned that part. The focus is many of the best players put up with slackers that suck and screw up and drag out the league. I get playing Lupz, JV, Aqua, Jer, me, etc... as we are reliable. And yes Lupz and JV and Aqua and Jer could be the next "A" players.

Link to post
Share on other sites
I get playing Lupz, JV, Aqua, Jer, me, etc... as we are reliable. And yes Lupz and JV and Aqua and Jer could be the next "A" players.

Coach, why don't you start an invitational league with those guys you just mentioned, plus a few more? I think there ARE 8 reliable B level guys that would play? Hell, maybe even a couple A guys would come if they know the league is going to be run efficiently? (I doubt this, but you never know?)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Who's Online   0 Members, 0 Anonymous, 13 Guests (See full list)

    There are no registered users currently online