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Which player got hosed the most?

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So overall, I think the NHL 94 ratings are pretty good...but a few players must've gone home to their kids playing this game and been like, "Why aren't you putting me in the starting lineup?" Kids would be like, "You're a 2/2 skater and a 69 overall... can't make Mario play with one hand tied behind his back." Rick Tocchet then breaks the Sega.  He's my pick for completely hosed... there's some others that I would guess weren't happy either, but Tocchet was 14th in scoring that year (1 pt behind Bure and 2 pts ahead of Roenick).  Just think if NHL 94 given him the indestructible qualities of big 27...world could be different now.  Sometimes, when I really get to thinking deeply, I power on the Sega and select Pittsburgh and I start to put in Tocchet...and then I put in Stevens instead 'cause I can't do that to Mario.  Any other players you think got hosed more than Tocchet?

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Somewhere on here, someone found a picture of the original Chicago ratings sheet (like a piece of paper with the ratings written on it, and notes about what lines they're on), and they're basically identical to the game, except for some reason the Michel Goulet got totally hosed in the game.

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Oh yeah...good call...whenever I play with Chicago, I want to put in Goulet but man he's so slow and that shot:(

21 minutes ago, smozoma said:

 Michel Goulet got totally hosed in the game.

 

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Gretzky got hosed bad. He should have had slightly more shot power and a lot more accuracy. 

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56 minutes ago, Bob Kudelski said:

Gretzky got hosed bad. He should have had slightly more shot power and a lot more accuracy. 

Gretzky had a bit of a muffin shot in the 90s.  His accuracy was based on his 92-93 shot % so it might accurate.  Although, a little bump would be nice due to rep.

Brian Leetch should be a four speed not a three.  Dude could fly and was one of the best puck moving dmen of that era.  Whereas, Luc Robitaille, for example, was a slow skater and yet, is rated a four. Things like that can be “annoying” but not a deterrent from playing.  Ray Bourque is rated too high in shot accuracy, for example, based on how he did in 92-93 vs how others were rated.  So, the rating logic is inconsistent there.  So, if he was rated on rep than several other dmen were hosed.

I do agree about Michel Goulet.

If anything, some of the fourth liners or 5-7 dman may have got “hosed.”  By default, most are given slow speed, low stick handling and weak shots.  Not all of it is accurate.

Maybe a few backup goalies could have been rated a little higher?  Hard to say.

All sports games have that one player who got hosed.  EA has it every year and usually it’s several players.  It’s the irony of “if it’s in the game, it’s in the game.”

Edited by The Sauce

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12 hours ago, The Sauce said:

Gretzky had a bit of a muffin shot in the 90s.  His accuracy was based on his 92-93 shot % so it might accurate.  Although, a little bump would be nice due to rep.

Brian Leetch should be a four speed not a three.  Dude could fly and was one of the best puck moving dmen of that era.  Whereas, Luc Robitaille, for example, was a slow skater and yet, is rated a four. Things like that can be “annoying” but not a deterrent from playing.  Ray Bourque is rated too high in shot accuracy, for example, based on how he did in 92-93 vs how others were rated.  So, the rating logic is inconsistent there.  So, if he was rated on rep than several other dmen were hosed.

I do agree about Michel Goulet.

If anything, some of the fourth liners or 5-7 dman may have got “hosed.”  By default, most are given slow speed, low stick handling and weak shots.  Not all of it is accurate.

Maybe a few backup goalies could have been rated a little higher?  Hard to say.

All sports games have that one player who got hosed.  EA has it every year and usually it’s several players.  It’s the irony of “if it’s in the game, it’s in the game.”

Goulet was in the twilight of his career, similar to Stastny, so I don't mind that their ratings aren't great. 

Gretzky is a bit different. In the early 90's, he was still putting up 100+ point seasons and averaging around .45 goals per game.

I agree a bump up based on his resume should have been warranted. The whole idea of basing the shot accuracy rating on one season of shooting percentage is flawed IMO, but I get why they did it. 

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I think Lafontaine (2nd in scoring in the league) should've had a higher rating...95-96.

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hard to predict rookie success, but... Kovalev.

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On 4/20/2020 at 8:49 PM, The Sauce said:

Ray Bourque is rated too high in shot accuracy, for example, based on how he did in 92-93 vs how others were rated.  So, the rating logic is inconsistent there.  So, if he was rated on rep than several other dmen were hosed.

I would bet that Bourque's rating was based on his results over the years during the accuracy shooting at the skills competition, and not on any actual gameplay. That leads me to this, brought to you instantly from the brain of Derp: How did the programers know who was actuall good? Did they have scouts? Did they scout?!?

- Gretzky got hosed.

- I feel the same about Kovalev, @trudatman

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6 hours ago, Mr. Derp said:

I would bet that Bourque's rating was based on his results over the years during the accuracy shooting at the skills competition, and not on any actual gameplay. That leads me to this, brought to you instantly from the brain of Derp: How did the programers know who was actuall good? Did they have scouts? Did they scout?!?

- Gretzky got hosed.

- I feel the same about Kovalev, @trudatman

Igor Kuperman did the ratings -- check out this cool page from his original ratings: https://forum.nhl94.com/index.php?/topic/18931-page-from-igor-kupermans-original-ratings/&tab=comments#comment-176720

Some of the stats are linked to the actual results from the 92-93 season such as shot accuracy, and I forget which others.

 

 

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On ‎5‎/‎19‎/‎2020 at 6:06 PM, Mr. Derp said:

I would bet that Bourque's rating was based on his results over the years during the accuracy shooting at the skills competition, and not on any actual gameplay. That leads me to this, brought to you instantly from the brain of Derp: How did the programers know who was actuall good? Did they have scouts? Did they scout?!?

- Gretzky got hosed.

- I feel the same about Kovalev, @trudatman

There are few players who have juiced attributes.  It's ok though.  It adds an element of fear/concern/strategy when you play against them.  In some cases, certain players have attributes that are incorrect (e.g - Robitaille was not a fast skater, Leetch was a quick skater, etc.).  I don't think it hurts the game play experience very much.  Yes, they did make guys like Ed Belfour super human.  He was a good goalie who was solid in the early 90s, and had a good year in 1992-93, but he wasn't better than Roy, at that time.  But, whatever.  It's an easy thing to debate (as stats can be misleading) but not worth it given how epic the game is for us fans.

As for Gretzky, he did get a "little hosed" because he was hurt most of 1992-93 and EA bases attribute ratings on prior year performance (with the obvious exception of Ray Bourque and his shot accuracy).  Still, Gretzky had 65 points in 45 games and he rebounded very nicely in 1993-94.  But, the 90s saw his goal production go down as he became a full-on "playmaker."  His skating declined and his shot power was never that good.  That said, I'm not sure where one would bump his attributes.  He's still got a good rating.

With Kovalev, he was a young player, fresh in the league at that time.  His 1992-93 season was nothing special as he hadn't reached his star power yet.  The one area that he is inaccurately rated is his stickhandling.  The guy was a legend with the puck on his blade.  He also had an underrated wrist shot (even though there is no rating for that skill) and while not a fast skater, had good edge work/balance.  He played the game at a slower pace and some misconstrued him as lazy or overrated in his early years.  My guess is, whoever scouted him, for this game, didn't know much about him and rated him conservatively.  But, he had only been in the league for a year so I kinda get why he is not rated like a superstar.

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Gretzky no doubt.

His playoff stats should have boosted him. He should have been on a level closer to Lemieux but as it was he was weak in the game.

You didn't even want him at center due to his shooting limitations. Sometimes you would even not have him on the first line due to his limitations and that strong passers not getting much rewarded for that attribute compared to shooters.

Look at his playoff stats that same year. He took LA to the Stanley Cup final scoring 15 goals 25 assists 40 points in 24 games. Shooting percentage of over 19%. Scored most points of the playoffs. Yes, he was hosed. Gretzky was still Gretzky back then and it is not reflected in the game.

       

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I don't think anyone has brought this name up before but Garry Galley really got shafted.

In 92-93 he was the 14th highest scoring dman in the league with a line of 13 goals, 49 assists, and 62 points.  That line earned him the title of 80th highest rated dman in NHL '94 with the below ratings.

2/2 skating, 3/4 aware, 2/1 shot, 3 sth & passing

In order to find a player rated lower than Galley on the point scoring list, one would have to look to Brad Shaw;s 41 points and 51 rating.

 

In 93-94 Galley improved his performance to 10 goals, 60 assists for 70 points. That performance was good for 8th in league scoring for dmen and it earned him a 58 overall rating with the below upgrades in NHL '95.

3/3 skating, 4 stick handling

 

Not sure what more Galley needed to do but Kuperman was not impressed.

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Good point @angryjay93. Galley did get shafted.

In a similar vein, Norm Maciver did too. 17 goals and 63 points as a Dman on the worst team in the league.

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I change my option from earlier. 
 

hasek finished 7th in GAA 7th in save %. But is the 22nd ranked goalie in the game. 

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41 minutes ago, halifax said:

I change my option from earlier. 
 

hasek finished 7th in GAA 7th in save %. But is the 22nd ranked goalie in the game. 

Sorta yes...sorta no...  at the time (1992-93), Hasek was battling Darren Puppa (greatest last name along with Tugnutt & Sidorkiewicz) for the back up role behind Fuhr.  He established himself as a legit starter in 1993-94, and never looked back.  But obviously, that wasn't known when the game was released.  I think it's possible that Kuperman didn't have accurate scouting (or perhaps robust scouting) on every player and maybe based it on rumored rep or what he saw vs what is/was the case.  Not surprising.  Not much different than what I do or Skip or Naples or C-Mac or Jkline, etc. on our roms  So, I can't totally discredit him for being off on some players, like a Hasek.  He may have had a mispreception based on either what he saw, in a limited fashion, and/or what was relayed back to him.  Back up goalies are rated on the lower side on the majority of the teams so perhaps, that's how the programmers wanted it.  Also, as we can imagine, the feedback on someone as unorthodox as Hasek must have been wild back in the day.

Was Kuperman ever a player scout?  I saw his bio and he is considered a hockey "historian."  I saw him, also, listed as a GM, which certainly doesn't mean you are a scout.  Anywo, for the most part, the game gets a lot of things right.  Certainly better than what EA rates players in their games today.

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Kuperman actually did the media guide for the 90-91 Super Series, which was the last Russian teams vs NHL showdown. I was supposed to scan it for nhl91.com but I never got around to it before I took the site down.
It doesn't say anything in there about him, though. 

Pretty much a useless comment on my part. Just trying to help out. I'll go, now. Cya.

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45 minutes ago, clockwise said:

Pretty much a useless comment on my part. Just trying to help out. I'll go, now. Cya.

That's one heck of a "exit stage left."  :)

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