PlabaxV2

I said abuse was the trade example you posted.. Not Icestorm getting Hull lol. I'm afraid to talk about GDL X trades because I made the worst ones

http://www.nflpickempool.net/GDLDraft/DraftedPlayers.php?Sort=OvR

I'm not afraid that I will lose, it is just an exploit that you guys are afraid to admit. Taking advantage of coaches who under value good players is another way of saying, I can gain draft position by purposely targeting those who clearly do not know the players well enough. It is abuse in the sense that nobody would ever think of making a trade like that if all the coaches had the knowledge to not undervalue a good player so much. Now you may say that it is "preference", but it's pretty ridiculous when someone appears to be throwing away so many spots in the draft only to move up 20-30 spots. This is when it becomes more than "preference" and it's a clean example of an exploit. Hope to see some good trades

He does not pay any price, which is the point of the exploit. Or else it would not be an exploit I guess we do need to chill, but it's clear that you guys aren't following what I am saying correctly so the wrong things are being thought and said.

Brutus, taking advantage of other coaches is an exploit. Moving up 20-30 spots in a draft because you know that you can find a better player so many spots after, is cheap. Preference cannot be an excuse because of the results this method has been producing. Where is the line for preference? Raph scored 262 PTS with Sandstrom and the excuse is "so many people would suck with Sandstrom"? There are not a lot of players in '94 capable of scoring 262 PTS, just to let you guys know lol.. I know that more than 80% of the people saying Sandstrom sucks have never used him before. It's just like how people say the light players are good, despite ever using the much. I actually used Sandstrom for the first time yesterday and lol.. I used to think he sucked, once you use him you realize how powerful he really is. We can't let this preference thing drag forever.

I think anyone reading the post knows that it is an exploit.. Icestorm even agreed that he is exploiting it by taking advantage of coaches... Zzz.. Please guys stop just admit to the truth

It is so sad that Icestorm does not understand my point.. You clearly cannot be going around trading players 10-15 spots down and then moving up 20-30 spots and then call it "theoretically swapping". Thats f**king cheap and that's what creates superteams

Even if it's my opinion, it's still an exploit. Who in the right mind would ever make that trade if the players were valued in a better order? Answer this question honestly : Are you not taking advantage of other coaches by doing this? If ADP has to be used it's better that only the picks can be traded to project your players unless you can actually make a fair trade that involves players only straight up. This way there nobody gets the chance to abuse the trading committee system. Because whether we like it or not, we are taking this preference thing a bit too far. There is a line we have to draw. We cannot say Michael Goulet and Roenick depends on preference. Some players are just simply better. The real problem is that we have been brainwashed to believe that certain players will suck if they are heavy. Example.. I used to think that Bourque sucked until Raph told me he was the 2nd best Dman in the game. Why would I think Bourque sucked if I had never used him? Because all of the brainwashing that goes on over here. Just a valid point and the truth so ty very much

This is what I've been saying the whole time.. This is an exploit. This would NEVER happen if all the coaches actually knew what they were doing. Are you guys serious? This is a cheap move that is only possible when one coach takes advantage of another coach. I say this because the first 10 players that are likely to be picked in the second round are actually worse than the following 10 picks (11-20).. This is just an easy way to exploit trades and look to ADP to support it lol. Here's an example if we were to use pick 24 and pick 35 from last GDL. 24 : Joe Juneau (Picked by Icestorm) 35 : Benoit Hogue (Picked by swos) Juneau has much higher ADP, but Hogue is clearly the better player.. This is how ADP is screwed up. This trade would certainly not be allowed BECAUSE whoever had pick 24 is getting so much extra trade value, which is why it's only fair if the pick is traded beforehand. Please guys, I would like to see a legit argument that counters this. And look even : 26: Fedorov, better than Juneau 27 : Robitaille, better than Juneau 31 : Sundin, better than Juneau 33: Roberts, better than Juneau 34 : Lemieux, better than Juneau 36 : Sanderson, better than Juneau 37: Oates, better than Juneau 38: Sandstrom, better than Juneau 44 : Courtnall, better than Juneau 45: Larmer, better than Juneau 47: Hawerchuk, better than Juneau 54: Makarov, better than Juneau 58: Hull, better than Juneau 80: Kamensky, better than Juneau 86: Muller, better than Juneau 92: Tikkanen, better than Juneau Need I say more?

Yeah.. what a waste of a thread trying to improve on GDL X only to make it worse. We have no proof of any positive input so stfu before you tell us we are usual suspects. Brutus has no experience, it's a very valid point. Just saying.

It's all negative input man.. This is a horrible idea im 100% with dcicon

He is elite. No player can get 262 PTS and not be elite. I consider my offense elite.. I would never be able to achieve 262 PTS lol. Sandstrom is a scoring machine. This is why it's so stupid. Most coaches have the mentality that he sux because he is heavy, so he doesnt get picked. Kovalenko is actually BAD but since he's light he'll get picked ahead of him. ADP is a bad way of determining skill, you can find players in rounds 4 and 5 who are better than a handful of players in round 2 and even one or two in round 1. For example, Icestorm complains that Bourque sucks because he is too heavy and that Wesley is better. Bourque is the 2nd best dman in the game for sure.. His stats are sexy as f**k but look how low he drops. It's not preference for me, it's actually the stats that just speak for itself. Sandstrom has a 5-5 shot, Bourque has a 5-5 shot, automatic elite.

Back to brutus' post. That brings us back to step one.. Where we were in GDL X. Brutus, if you saw the GDL X draft you would know that Icestorm clearly has extreme issues handling the trades, even with a committee.

And before you think I'm trolling. This is a perfect example. Player A has Kovalenko (Gutter Trash player) Player B has Sandstrom (Elite Player) Player A trades Kovalenko to Player B for Sandstrom. The trade gets vetod. Here are the scenarios : Scenario 1 - Trade does NOT fit formula, committee then uses ADP and sees that they are close enough in ADP. Kovalenko has the slight edge in ADP so it is assumed Kovalenko is a tiny bit better. It is deemed a fair trade. Result : It is actually Player A who wins the trade. Player A knows how much extra value he can earn by exploiting this. Player A had the higher pick, but due to all the bad players that go before the draft steals, he takes the bad player with a high ADP any chance he gets so he can successfully execute his trades. Scenario 2 : Trade fits formula but because the picks are extremely close to each other the trades go through. Result : Player A exploits the draft formula to make what is deemed a "fair" trade by the committee. Scenario 3 : The coaches don't use the formula/ADP and say.. This is the police and we're here to stop this robbery. We won't let this act of expulsion happen. You are under arrest Result : Player B is mad, but it's better than being fucked by a smart coach (who is usually a top coach), right?

It doesn't matter brutus. Rules are rules. If a trade is vetod and it doesn't meet the criteria for a fair trade, then what must be done? The committee can't just drop the formula after it's been established and go against it. That will cause problems. Raph is not a demon. He just has vaseline. Carse has vaseline too and hopefully I get some this season. It shows that a coach is smart and good at the draft game. The thing is ADP is the easy and unfair way of using your vaseline. The real way is to trade your picks and use ADP to PROJECT the players you will get. It's basically vaseline only without commiting any vaselina.

Why we should not have the formula as a guideline 1. Swos and I can't even think of a trade that even meets the criteria. So obv most (95%) of the trades won't work. 2. A trade that actually meets the criteria will be so fair that nobody will dare veto it. Most of all : 3. What if a "fair" trade is vetod by a troll? Think of it, If a troll were to veto the trade because he knew it didn't fit the formula then what happens? I say this because 100% of the vetod trades WON'T fit the formula, so what is the point?

Why? His stats are great, what did he do to you. In high-level video game playing the key to winning is whoring the game. When you play by who you like or w/e you will never win. Funny how it matches up with Icestorm perfectly. Fact is, I don't "like" Tikkanen. I just use him because he has some great stats but nobody takes him until round 4. Stats are what matters and you cannot deny the fact that Tikk has some better stats than most of the 2nd rounders

It's not hard.. Tikk is an all-star lolol as Raph says you can lead the league with Jay Caufield it doesnt matter

Look how stupid it is, If Sandstrom can abuse his slappers to lead the league in points, then it's just like picking Dino Ciccarelli in the 2nd round. Dino is no good unless he's coming off a one-timer. Everybody but swos got abused by Sandstrom and now you are saying that it's no big deal? Yeah right, for someone who can score as many goals as I can.. 262 PTS while trying my hardest with a "better" player is a dream. It is not really a unique understanding. For someone who lost to TomKabs (NYR) in 5 games with the all weight-bug MTL, it is funny how you can pretend not to link 2 and 2 together EVEN AFTER you traded your "good" players for a "worse" Sandstrom and say it's no big deal. Raph knows the light noobs like the ones on MTL actually suck, so he uses them as trade bait to trade for players like Sandstrom because the ppl he trades to dont realize it. If you led your team with Russ do you really think you could score 262 points? Pls lol stop. They are not "worthless" without a bugger.. Go look at GENS A and we can all see how Tikkanen (4th Rounder) fucked everyone WITHOUT any buggers. Pls and TY stop with the lies and I really hope I can make my team the way I want.

Someone is clearly missing the point here. Raph led the league with Sandstrom, because he is good. Raph cannot lead the league with Russ Courtnall, or 40% of the people who are picked BEFORE Sandstrom. Sandstrom was picked at 38th Overall, and he's ELITE. Nobody leads the league without an elite player. What happens when Raph brings the vaseline with a trade? Only to have ADP as an excuse. Here's an example : Kovalenko has high ADP, but hes maybe a top 150 player. Sandstrom's ADP is lower, but he's ELITE. The ADP's are close so really the trade looks close, but it's only being made because whoever is receiving Sandstrom knows they are in the money. You need to trade down to get high trade value if you realize these things.. It's a steal and think of how easy it is to bait people. Unless the trades are made BEFORE the fags are picked in the second round, I guarantee we will see a bunch of unfair trades being let through because of this ADP scam. ADP is s**t, most pick decisions are s**t. Icestorm, Raph know very well what I mean and you can look at the GDL X trades and see how this is a problem. We have comments from Raph saying "I just tripled my weight" trying to cover up a highway vaseline filled robbery trade lol. Come on. Fix it.

So why is the thread called Trade RULES? The formula is clearly meant to be a RULE, not a fkin guideline. Approvals should not have to be required, because I'm telling you now a couple of things : 1. Half the coaches wont know the formula off the top of their heads 2. It takes time to calculate, nobody can do it on the spot 3. More than 80% of the trades you'll see won't fit in the formula. Yesterday Ice came up with the fairest way he could to accquire two second rounders, and he said the trade was something anybody would say was fair. Once we calculated and we found out it wasn't, he said I had to ask smoz how to do it correctly. What a joke lol srsly? The way we handled trades in Blitz 08 was perfect, we don't need to change it. We can't use ADP history that well because most trades will include weight buggers. Unlike in Blitz, coaches in GDL don't really know who is good and who is not.. You can find Stephan Lebeau picked before Mario Lemieux, should we really use ADP?? Wasn't the best player in GDL X picked 38th overall? Elite players are always at the bottom half of round 2 so there's no way that will work. The cause of the problems comes from people not knowing how to value players correctly, so the trades usually involve one smart player (Raph, Ice, Me (if this formula vanishes)) and one noob because they don't understand the players all that well.

Do away with the formula. We handled Blitz 08 trades great no reason we can't do it here since there's a limit now.

He is right that they fked up on the one timers in '94 (for GENS, not SNES), that is certainly a negative when looking at the game. He forgot to mention the manual goalie control, which I guess had an effect on the verdict. I'm not too sure what he's talking about in the "Ratings" or the "Shootout Mode" section.. Needless to say, not the best article.

I think LABS said it best.. Just give them the pick of the team they are replacing. Much easier (Y) and the fairest option by far.

Don't worry brutus.. Houly switches his teams constantly and is never sure of who he wants to play as.