Depch

Finding out that these hacks have been in GDL since season 9 changes quite a bit what kind of talks there can be involving the league. Even in season 9 there was a vote about goalie Y button for example. A ) If hacks are continued to be used, then talks of new hacks should be open too. Only one that is basically out of the question is weight bug fix or it would be just another Blitz and tbh weight bug doesn't feel so much of a bug anymore after the invention of CB (But I get the point for some). And lael, we actually had votes about new hacks for this season, forgot about that first, here's the thread http://forum.nhl94.com/index.php/topic/16496-gdl-xii-poll-y-button-gc-and-cb-fix/. B ) Return to Classic rom with no hacks that affect the game itself in any way excluding the team bonuses. It's only been 3 seasons since the haxes have been involved. There is more legacy in the classic GDL (8 seasons) vs 3 seasons with hacks on. I did not see any kind of vote on turning up to use #5 patch for hot/cold values. This should be defaulted back to #1. But in reality it looks like there are only 2 ways to vote A ) #1 & #3 options for those who want to hide the true values from line changes. Difference between #1 & #3 are only how they are shown in line changes. Thus making #1 logical option before #3 for the legacy sake. B ) #4 & #5 options for those who want to see true values in line changes too. Someone already brought up that there would be some rotten apples, who are so selfish that they would use this to their own advantage and cause desyncs. Also option #5 really can make or break someones games. Just played 4 exis with Plab where Kamensky had his 4 skill set as 63-66 _4_ games a row. This essentially made him more like Clark who has an adp of 50+ to Kamensky. This would be very unlikely to happen in options #1, #3, #4 as each attribute gets a random hot/cold value like in classic version of nhl94. While the player skills won't change much of the results, some games they might have difference does the shot go in, is your guy wobbling from b-checks etc. From this deduction we can get to options #1 and #4 being the only ones that have any sense. And that would be to show the true values in line changes or not. Skip could return the #1 option back to the rom or if not I can do it. ps. All this included hacks removes some prestige I've had towards GDL, still a great league, but I had thought of it as a "clean" league before this thread. Great thing this thread happened though. : p [EDIT] Option #2 works as well, just failed to apply it in my first test to a random rom.

I do trust in statistics and propabilities most of the time. If we would track the desyncs and saw an increase with a certain guy, we know what's going on and he could be booted from the community, like forever. But it's a job and perhaps it is better to avoid even with keeping the true ratings hidden. This is not the case in current GDL and who knows for how many seasons, we have the roms to download so I can check it up since when this has been applied. I think #1 has to be in the discussion. Like how is that different from #3? The only difference between them is that #1 is classic/default, no need to make any changes to rom and both of them apply each attribute separatedly cold or hot. #1 just shows fake ratings and #3 shows true natural rating. Both of them conceal the true value and both give hot/cold for each skill separatedly. [edit] Found it, season 8 in GDL is the last one using the default system #1. Since season 9 we have been using fix #5. aka that is only 3 seasons of using #5, 8 seasons of using #1. Not too late to change it imo should there be a vote or whatever.

I really want to keep this topic hot as it's a big issue. In my mind out of all the hacks Smoz provided the #5 hot/cold fix is the worst. Has it been applied to GDL that long ago that it's too late to change it now. Keep it for the legacy or has this been done like in the later GDL:s like gdl 7 or 8 and so on when it might not be too late to change it, if people should feel so. #1 I think default is ok, even though the info is not shown correctly, it's just to mask separated hot/cold for each attribute on each player. #2 For me this is the best option. As it is to reduce the luck factor in games, but for hardcore console gamers this might be too revolutionary and people might resist, totally understand it. And it might be too drastic for a 6 step player skill evaluation. Huge difference 3=54, 4=72, 5=90!! #3 This is like #1 in Classic, just that the player skills are shown as unchanged default skills instead of a fake hot/cold. #4 This is very nice as well. It will allow you to view skills in edit lines and make line changes accordingly. It gives each unique skill on each player a hot or cold. #5 This is the worst option in my mind. Some games you might end up with a super Gartner of 98 speed,agility,shotpower,stickhandling and so on and at the same time if you get really unlucky you might be playing against that as a Muller of 63 speed,agi,shotpower,accuracy,stickhandling,passing. Even #4 is better than this, because it will reduce the chances of a bad luck, it's really unlikely all your skills would be 63 with that option with Muller. I'll give another example of this vice verse. Muller could be some games 80 speed, agi, shotpower, accuracy, stickhandling,passing so on and Gartner ends up shitting up as 81 speed,agi,shotpower,stickhandling. =) So in my mind, GDL has the worst option for the fix currently. Please give your opinions and especially some oldschoolers of GDL could participate to take heed, is option #5 too legacy to be ever changed for GDL?

Vancouver up for trades again! Trades used 8/10 O: Cliff Ronning Valeri Kamensky Ron Francis Pat Falloon Corey Millen John Leclair D: Paul Coffey Dave Ellet Garth Butcher Chris Joseph G: Terreri Waite Not sure what I'm looking for, doing quite ok with my squad as well, but might as well kill time with some trading for the fun of it or to just get some change.

To some degree I do like it as well, especially in casual games. But I'm thinking figuratively here if NHL'94 should become a bigger competitive game, which it has all the merits to be one, then like in most other competitive scenes the effect of luck is always minimized with different settings/hacks usually. In that sense #2 is something to not completely ditch out and I'd be up for a tournament, cup or something with that, but not now, sometime in the future. I'm in a way more open to this anyways, because my background is from PC gaming and there the skills were always static, but like I previously said with increments of 5 so the difference between 3-4-5 might be too much as it's almost 20.

Tyvm all. Season was fun from the start and I clicked well with St Louis from the start. I was using Brown-Giles defence pairing at start a lot, but eventually came up with Brown-Butcher and totally fell in love with Butcher. He's so slow and so bad in offensive awareness that he provides a very good and structured 5on5 game and Brown complemented him nicely (or maybe the other way around =)). After GDL Draft started and I stepped out of my planned route of player picks I had to learn C/B with Coffey and that translated to Classic playoffs then as well. Will definately join Classic 2015 Spring to defend the title. Hope to see a full league then as well and create a tough choises for team picks in the latter part of team draft then. Maybe we'll get a few more A guys in as well who can shrug of their thought of having to play with a weaker team. =)

So we are using the following settings. Classic #1 (default) GDL #5 Blitz #3 I would be really really interested in trying out option #2. If we can remove some random things from the game, then for a competitive side that should be encouraged. This has a minor problem with skill values 3 -> 4 -> 5 having huge differences, but in a way it would be really interesting. I would even nullify the crowd effect if that was possible for the competitive side, those extra boosts and AI positional fumbles are just weird sometimes. Games would be closer overall if those didn't occurr, I'd guess. 1=34 2=43 3=54 4=72 5=90 6=99 I also like option #4 a lot and can understand #3 very well. The option #5 seems to be the odd one out, any clues when that was implemented to GDL?

This information by Brutus would seem to confirm it all. Blitz has the system where all 4 skills are always showed as 72 but maybe they vary separatedly like in Classic (where they don't show the right values though?). GDL just marks the skill value for a random attribute value withint that range and it applies to all similar skill values for that certain player. Skills shown in line changes / team roster are valid. My personal preferation would be classic system, with correct values shown. I am fine with all of these though, since it is the same for everyone, but having a Francis of 63 max skill is devastating, well just not gonna use him then in GDL for example in those games. =) I don't want to think that we have such a rotten apples in the community who would use this attribute knowledge to the extend of creating a desync. Desyncs are relatively rare in this community for my experience at least and seeing an increased value by some would cause suspicions and if it would be verified, such a guy would deserve a 100% ban from the whole community. This is however great and new info for me and will be able to use it for my personal gain, as will everyone be able to do so. Few mysteries for me still are the RB screen, which I live in a suspicion that it has zero effect. But what about the hot and cold, is it applies in Blitz or was that just speculation/hearsay. The other mystery is crowd effect/momentum. I have absolutely no clue how that works, but some games the AI just plays way way better and there is even some difference within the games as well. Sometimes the AI rushes to intercept passes by themselves, sometimes they're making odd turns at weird times creating more like a paveway to your goal for those 5 speeders. Sometimes they're very structured and this varies within games and against same opponents.

I used to reset that with alt-tab from fullscreen to windowed mode. But playing in windowed mode visiting the menu via alt and coming back from it fast with another alt press will reset the fps lag back to 60. Problem is that sometimes, just sometimes while it might fix the problem temporarily, it might give you an input lag. :E I might try this weekend with different settings and gens compatibility modes more. It's easy to change by mouse2 on gensnetplay.exe, clicking properties and from the settings there change the compatibility mode. To add to the discussion I have had the similar problem vs Swos one year ago when he used 2 setups for games if I'm correct. With his XP laptop I had a similar FPS problem as with Seth and on the other setup no problems. At least I recall this being the case. It was not connection caused fps lag but rather system compatibilities or something else.

This was being discussed yesterday in the GDL chat. It seems there is something very different from the default settings. Skill value of the 0-6 give an attribute value of X. 0=25 (25) 1=25-43 (34) 2=34-52 (43) 3=45-63 (54) 4=63-81 (72) 5=81-99 (90) 6=99 I'm leaving out the RB as I have no clue how that works or does it have any effect to anything. But in edit lines / team roster: Classic: All skills seem to be separated from eachother. Hot/Cold seems to range from -9 to +9 for each attribute. Muller can be 80 agility and 72 speed. I Do not know does this reflect to the game correctly as well. GDL: Let's say you have Muller who is 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 44 4 4 in skill values for each attribute, ok maybe a few 4:s too much, but you get the point. In GDL your skill value 4 might get attribute value of 63 one game and 80 the other game. That would mean Muller is possibly one game 63 agility 63 speed and so on and on another one he'd be 80 agi and 80 speed and so on (Him getting his 4 valued to 80 would actually make him very very good already). Blitz: All skills seem to be defaulted always to their basic value. Like Muller would always be 72 agility and 72 speed in team roster/edit lines. -Someone stated that the RB hot/colds would have affect in Blitz, but it does not look like so in the edit lines / team rosters. -In GDL even you can easily notice a player with 5 speed having different speeds, sometimes Ronning is just an average joe like Emerson when he gets his number 5 skill value rated as 82. Some games he's one of the fastest guys in the game when the speed hits 90+. I do not know if the line changes attributes reflect to the game correctly, but Plabax confirmed that this would be so in GDL. The same difference can be seen with Kamensky 5 shotpower easily, same games it's just like Francis and sometimes he blasts them like Hull. There is variance there. Plabax seemed to suggest that there might be something with the incremential of 10:s. As it is evident with stickhandling 80+ at least. In the 70's you fall for a B-check most of the time and with 80+ you get the wobble effect. In the PC version of NHL Hockey the attribute skills were by the incremential of 5. Like 75-80-85-90-95-100 and so on.

I add my analyzis on the smoothing issue. Never = No changes Near UB = never tested myself, but the idea of an changing framerate during the game might cause issues while playing, in theory at least Smoothing extra = +1 frame Smoothing always = +2 frame So when I ping 110ms with Kingraph and get to play a 4 frame game, which works very well, if I added smoothing always the game would be frame 6 and that would be added latency. This added artificial latency might be usefull if your ping is not stable and your FPS is jumping in the game with someone, or just your connection. It will give smoothness to the game then but your players will react to keypresses slower than they would with that -2 frame game. Some of the FPS lags are not about connection, but seem to be more like a compatibility of systems issue. Like against Seth, whom I ping very well with and there are no fps jumps caused by the connection, but my FPS starts to drop out towards ~20 every few game minutes and I need to alt-alt to reset it back to 60 for a while. I have not tested smoothing with this. Last time I tried this alt-alt after the lag system it caused my players go to a huge lag in player input on how they react to what I press. Seth on the other hand says the connection is great for him and by definition of raw connection between us it is. But something else is doing this. It might be a good idea to get out all the info players have on their gens and have they noticed how the game feels best for them. I got Windows 7 64bit and run gens on an XP compatibility mode as people have said that Gens would work very well with XP. Recommend that for everyone at least to test. I also play with no sound usually in gens, but don't think that has any effect on the game itself. Have tried other rendering options for a faster responsiviness too, but no difference felt in games, other than a possible placebo effect, 2xSAI looks a bit funny though and the combined interpolated and scanline make it look a bit too much of a Spectrum PC. Sometimes switching between windowed and full screen mode might give you a better feel of the game and your players in responsiviness, but this is another possible placebo effect. I'd be really happy to know if other players have noticed anything, just out of their mind, even anything having a placebo effect and if you have any solution for the problem I have had with Seth for example.

Vancouver will pull out from the trades and gonna stick to my current roster. So posting my final lineups below for the next rom. #NC, #SC1, #PP1, #PK1: Ronning-Kamensky-Falloon Butcher-Ellet // X: Leclair #SC2, #PP2, #PK2: Falloon-Francis-Millen Coffey-Ellet // X: Leclair #CHK: Millen-Leclair-Leclair Lidster-Coffey // X: Francis #G1/2: Terreri / Waite ^ These are not yet in v15.

If you want to hit a post in Gens version, you can easily hit it by shooting top right corner of the goal (up&left when doing offence down) for example, easy to do after the play has stopped and the goalie animation is not following you anymore. The goalie post sound is there and there is some physics involved in the rebound too. For some reason it was decided to not be included in the game or to become ultra rare. Like TK said the goal does like to suck in some goals that would sometimes look to miss with the shot trajectionaries, it has the tendency to rather give a goal then, but it's the same always for both. Learning the goal suckage area will help you score with some pass shots for example, this is very important. I think the goal suckage was rather added to it than to keep the posts, it is possible that this was intended. We're not playing a simulation so it does not bother me at all. Another thing I have to mention here for the benefit of the Gens system is that it's the universal engine. I myself come from PC platform, for me the NHL'94 game was called "NHL Hockey", but it's with the exact engine that the Sega one has (I think it derives from NHL'93 actually, because it didn't have GC and the pass shots felt a bit different from angles, but it also had MANUAL aim on onetimers, which is a huge plus over Gens version ++ league systems of 84 games and so on with multiple human players and player trading in leagues, own statistics). On PC platform players still enjoyed that great Gens engine in PC NHL'95 (Bob Kudelski did seem to mention this). I would say that when people think of NHL'94 more people will be more familiar with the Gens engine, it goes past to just Gens vs Snes, but both are great hockey games. A pissing match between the two is the last thing we need, but this is an excellent thread to the documentary as it has to be able to go through the different versions and their differences. It's a legendary game on both/all platforms and I doubt we will ever fully come to concensus that will unite the both communities fully under the same platform. =)

I like option 3, as 2 has some inbalances in geographically. Like me (euro) with a guy from BC and Darko (euro) with one from California. I'm personally fine with all, but actually feel 3 is better overall. But options 2/3 are both ok.

Streaming live happens in other lag sensitive games too, like LOL/FPS-games. It basically shouldn't affect your connection that much. This might've been different like 10 years ago and even today as it is very upstream dependant. People used to have like 1Mbit upstream, which would start to affect games then too, but with 2Mbit+ it should not be a problem. Can easily try to stream some exis with ustream what we've used in Kibas NHL95 manager league. Have not tried twitch, which is the more popular one for games, but the idea should be the same.

This, updating the web page and introducing plenty of new features, introducing a small money pool for some of the major tournaments like 50$ (I could do that as a charity) and all are the things that we can make this community to grow even more. The game is known to be legendary by all already, just proper marketing and more people would join up. The basis of a good active community already is there to work as a magnet. It's all right there if we just want to make it, because it's all doable. Think big! Daeemn w**ds!#51?

Those who are looking for skill plays / fancy goals it's really not there, it was mostly very defensive hockey with tight checking and not much openings. I think one of the games was a full blowout vice verse. Also neither had the benefit of having a speed 5+ player either to create that room and few were the breakaways too. So there was not much room there to work with and Boston was very good at intercepting passes too, I couldn't utilize Hull as well as previously, minus the series vs Montreal.

Here is a player split geographically (considering the trans-atlantic cable pops out from New york in NA). I have the kingraph tiers on next to them, but lowered Lupz to 4.0 by his request and Jagr & Jer to 4.5 as not much difference between them from 4.0. Western conference: Plabax 1.0 (Ont) Freydey 1.0 (Que) Brutus 2.5 (Ill) Houly 2.5 (Que) sicarius 2.5 (Miss) Kupuck 3.0 (Cali) BoKnows 3.0 (Penn) Skeletor 4.0 (BC) JJ 4.0 (Col) Labs 4.0 (Penn) Jagr 4.5 (Ill) Jer 4.5 (Ont) Eastern conference: ((NY,Mass,Europe) Kingraph 1.5 (NY) Icestorm 1.5 (NY) Depch 1.5 (Euro) Uncle Seth 2.0 (NY) Fitzo 2.0 (Euro) Minpind 2.5 (Mass) Donnybrook 2.5 (Mass) Lupz 4.0 (NY) Darko 4.0 (Euro) Tx 4.0 (NY) Skip 4.0 (Mass) JV 4.0 (Mass) Looking at location the EU should be on the eastern conference obviously. Connection first comes to NY and the closest states to that are Pennsylvania and Massachutets where we have players from. Should at least be west & east: West: Brutus 2.5 Sicarius 2.5 Kupuck 3.0 Skeletor 4.0 JJ 4.0 Jagr 4.5 East: Depch 1.5 Fitzo 2.0 Darko 4.0 That leaves the below guys to be generally changeable between themselves to be sorted out to ones liking to balance out the conferences and from there you can easily split the divisions. If Ontarians are from Toronto or closeby even people from Ontario could be here, I'm actually doing that right up. Freydey 1.0 (Que) Plabax 1.0 (Ont) Kingraph 1.5 (NY) Icestorm 1.5 (NY) Uncle 2.0 (NY) Houly 2.5 (Que) Minpind 2.5 (Mass) Donny 2.5 (Mass) Bo 3.0 (Penn) Labs 4.0 (Penn) Lupz 4.0 (NY) Tx 4.0 (NY) Skip 4.0 (Mass) JV 4.0 (Mass) Jer 4.5 (Ont) If anyone can build an even conferences/divisions out of the geographical basis here, then go for it. [EDIT] If Freydey and Plabax have to be in different conferences I'd put out Plabax on west and Frey on east. West also needs a 1.5 guy with Plabber and the "farthest" living ones from Europe perspective is Ice (I ping 140-150ms to Ice and 110ms to Kingraph, that's a difference of 1 frame). Uncle Seth also pings very well to Europe so he must live on the very much of east coast. It's very much impossible to create a regional/skill based even conferences as that would mean someone of Raph/Seth should be on west and by regional/latency wise it would not be good. This leaves the top end of west a bit lacking, but making a very even mid tier. I also modified the ratings to my liking. I'm putting Plab on a tier of his own at the moment and I think Frey is next and then Raph when it comes to consistency. While Ice & I can win games vs the guys above us in tiers, it's not consistent. And nothing bad to Fitzo but I think Seth is a notch above. West: Plabax 1.0 Icestorm 1.75 Houly 2.25 Brutus 2.25 Minpind 2.25 Sicarius 2.25 Kupuck 2.5 Labs 4.0 Skeletor 4.0 JJ 4.0 Jer 4.5 Jagr 4.5 East: Freydey 1.25 Kingraph 1.5 Depch 1.75 Uncle 2.0 Fitzo 2.25 Donny 2.25 Bo 2.75 Darko 4.0 Lupz 4.0 Tx 4.0 Skip 4.0 JV 4.0 + I have some limited experience vs the new guys and some of the older ones so there is plenty of 4.0 right there, which is subject to change.

We had a good community for this when we used to play this. Many years afterwards we would even come back to this as NHL2005 & 2006 were bad ones. This, what you said is the problem with the game in my mind. When playing on all-star level you only score mostly with onetimers & snap shots from the b-point, at least that felt the most frustrating and eventually bored me out at least. But the game is fun and has quite a nice an engine. Tall players have also a longer stick and a team of big guys can be made effective in this game too with very effective poking. =) It was pretty fun.

v11 updates with my FA move & trade with Lupz GDL_SeasonXII_v11.bin

Vancouver & Winnipeg on the trades again. Reversing sort of the previous one. The trade didn't pan properly for either team. Chelios & Otto <-> Kamensky, Ellet Van trades used 7/8

Vancouver on the FA moves again. Dropping Matvichuk and picking up Lidster from FA. Trades used 6/8

Aaand.. Another FA move, this has not been updated to v8. Dropping Dirk Graham and adding up John Leclair from FA. Trades used 5/8

Updated my lines and numbers to the rom, here is v8 GDL_SeasonXII_v8.bin

Another FA switch for Vancouver. Dropping Lamb and getting Graham from FA. Trades used 4/8