Brodeur30

Smaller Goal mod

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I have been working on a smaller goal mod for NHL 94 on Genesis. I have edited the artwork to work with the code that edits the barrier of the goal posts and of the boards. So this is complete with accurate collision of the goal posts with the puck with updated goal artwork.

There are several different sizes of goals.

Here are some photos of the smallest goal: (updated 11/16/19)

smallestupdatetopgoal2.jpegsmallestupdatebotgoal.jpeg

Playing roms with this goal size produces very low scoring games. One way I have made this goal size more playable is by lowering goalie glove ratings to create more shots that bounce off the goalie. In the updated version I have lowered the top goal's crossbar.

 

Here are some photos of the medium size goal :

mediumalt.jpegmediumgoal2.jpeg

The medium version's posts are black while the smaller goal's posts are red because below the size editable in the goal artwork tile you have to choose from predetermined artwork by changing a single-byte vale.

 

Here is the larger version of the goal done from the goal art tiles :

largergoal1.jpeglargergoal2.jpeg

This one is slightly smaller than the normal goals in NHL 94.

Each version works with a different value for the barriers code and each of these versions provide different challenges with different goal post and board collision values. I have roms for each goal size, and you could start by playing the larger version of the goal then try the smaller versions and see if you can score. You will be blown away by the goal post collisions and when goals miss the goal on shots compared to what you're used to. You can look at this as a way to adjust the accuracy of one-timers and shots. On the smaller goals hitting wide open nets with shots will no longer be automatic. You will now have to place your shots and pay more attention to angles since the goal post barrier code has been tailored to the artwork. If you play on the smallest goal you should expect a lot of 0 - 0 games and if you score it could end up being the winner. Playing on longer periods and real-time clock is essential to this mod since the smaller the goal the longer it will take you to score.

Are you interested in testing NHL 94 with smaller goals with all the goal artwork updated? Will it change your strategy on how you score? Playing with smaller goals will make one-timers more realistic because they no longer will be automatic scores. Now they will hit off the post more or miss the goal completely.

With different versions of goal sizes you can play on the goal size that you want, if the smallest version of the goal is too small and you are getting frustrated at not being able to score goals you can use the medium one. There really aren't too many other goal sizes that are possible than these due to the artwork limitation. Any smaller than the smallest one it's pretty much impossible to score. But be forewarned, after you experience playing NHL 94 with these smaller goals and adjusted collision you may not be able to go back to playing with regular sized goals again because you may find it too easy to score.

Simply put, playing on these roms will make your NHL 94 experience more advanced and strategic since scoring becomes more difficult with a smaller target to score. So much so that I now am looking for a way to slow down the goalie speed as even with the lowest player ratings they will move quickly from side to side. You will see what I mean if you test these roms.

Before I release these roms I need to do some more testing and add some more codes to them like the real-time clock code because you'll need that extra time to score on the smaller goals. What goal size do you think you will play on? Do you think playing on the smallest goal will be too hard for you to score and you'll want to play on the medium size or larger size?

I think some have tested my barriers code but until you edit the goal artwork you can't really get the full experience. So this is something I'm working on and if there is interest I can release the roms for you to test.

Edited by Brodeur30
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My favorite is the smallest goal that I have been working on the most. I think it looks the best with the red post artwork. The medium one I couldn't get quite right because the left post intersects with the artwork a pixel off. It's because the goals are a pixel off, but it still plays great. One thing I did was improved the bottom net on the smaller one to be curved like the middle one.

If you like low scoring games the smallest goal is for you but for a more reasonable compromise is the medium goal. I have been working mostly on the smallest goal and the medium one. I have some final edits to do but once I have added all the codes that I use I will release the roms.

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Great work and very interesting.  

Looking forward to trying out.  After 94 EA shrunk the goals/widened the goalies hit box in 95.   Never really noticed until recently playing some 94 manual goalie and realized how much more ground you have to cover to prevent goals going in.

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58 minutes ago, segathon said:

Great work and very interesting.  

Looking forward to trying out.  After 94 EA shrunk the goals/widened the goalies hit box in 95.   Never really noticed until recently playing some 94 manual goalie and realized how much more ground you have to cover to prevent goals going in.

Right, 94 has tight collision between the puck and the goalie compared to the later games. But to compensate for that the goalies move really fast. Even if you lower the goalie attributes to 0 they still cover a lot of ground quickly like by tracking the puck horizontal position and moving from one side of the net to the other. When you lower the size of the goal the goalies still move left to right to the same position but now this position they stop is beyond the post so you get new angles. Combine that with the lowered accuracy of one-timers causes a lot of one-timer attempts to miss the goal completely and slam into the boards behind the goal. This is a whole new gameplay element. Smaller goals also reduce the puck warping to the center area of the net effect when you score goals. With smaller goals this looks better since the puck no longer warps very far from where it went in and crossed the goal-line. So really the goal target areas will be super small compared to what you're used to, because in addition to making the goals smaller I also matched it so no longer will pucks become goals by warping through the posts. This process of matching smaller goal artwork to the barriers code also changes a lot of collision around the goal. For example when skating from certain angles players will avoid bumping into the goal and will skate right through the edge of the back of the goal.

Which goal size do you think you will try first? Will you start to work your way down from the biggest size to the medium to the smallest or would you just jump right down to the smallest goal size and try the smallest first?

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probably smallest just to see the effect it has.

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I have a couple different versions of the medium sized goal. I just updated the first post with another version of it. That one may look better with the grey pixels. The smallest goal is pretty much ready to go, that's the one I've been testing the most. I could curve out the back of the bottom goal on the smallest goal like I did the medium goal, or leave it straight.

I think what I'm gonna do is update the latest medium goal rom so it's got the alternate style top goal with the grey pixels combined with the curved back of the regular medium bottom goal. The alternate medium goal looks more square which one looks better do you think? The smallest goal I could probably leave the bottom goal square shaped.

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Nice work!

I've always toyed with the idea of doing a, 'shinny,' ROM. I believe there is a way to get the puck to stay close to the ice on shots that @Tony H figured out, or at least someone did.

If you could make the crossbar closer to the ice, it might actually work with a 3on3 or 2on2. Then, use the titles (just copy the hex code) for the outdoor style game from the ball hockey hack and update the tiles to look like it's a pond.

Wish I had more time because I'd like to take a crack at it.

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7 hours ago, segathon said:

probably smallest just to see the effect it has.

Good news I am almost finished with the smallest goal rom, so I will release that one first so you can start testing this. The cross bar has been lowered a pixel from what you see in the first screenshot, I just need to make some final edits to the rom like adding a couple of codes via hex edits. This is a mod where the full rom really needs to be shared since there are a lot of art edits and ratings balanced needed to make this playable. I am making some final edits to this rom tonight so you will be able to test the smallest goal shortly. Stay tuned!

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4 hours ago, clockwise said:

Nice work!

I've always toyed with the idea of doing a, 'shinny,' ROM. I believe there is a way to get the puck to stay close to the ice on shots that @Tony H figured out, or at least someone did.

If you could make the crossbar closer to the ice, it might actually work with a 3on3 or 2on2. Then, use the titles (just copy the hex code) for the outdoor style game from the ball hockey hack and update the tiles to look like it's a pond.

Wish I had more time because I'd like to take a crack at it.

By getting the puck to stay closer to the ice on shots are you talking about like a shot modifier that keeps shots going on a lower trajectory? That's relevant to the smaller goal because there's an adjustment of both the horizontal and the vertical barriers to make the smaller goal mod, anotherwords the location of the crossbar barrier in code, the position where shots no longer become a goal and either hit the cross bar or go over the goal. You can adjust this further the problem is if you lower it farther than the setting I have it on you will lose the back of the net collision and the goal will not look as good visually. I've tested this extensively and have settled on barrier values for the smallest goal. I think in actuality the top goal of the smallest goal is how it looks in the screenshot with the higher crossbar. I tried to get it so pucks hit the crossbar in both the top goal and the bottom goal which is challenging because you can't get it perfect, there is always that 1 pixel difference of where the puck is when comparing the top goal to the bottom goal. I got it pretty close though. 

I had to lower the cross bar pixel by pixel so it matches better with the value of the barrier code. When working on a smaller goal  I started to notice differences between the bottom goal and the top goal and discovered they aren't perfectly aligned in reference to the puck. For example if you're watching a replay then you reverse the camera angle if you pay close attention the puck will be 1 pixel off in terms of where it crosses the goal line (top goal vs bottom goal) and it's distance from the goal line visually. So I had to fine tune this a lot I wanted to make sure the goal looks relatively normal, you know side posts length vs cross bar length. As far as adjusting the trajectory of shots I'd be interested to see what Tony H did with that. Because since I lowered the cross bar and the barrier of it you will see more shots flying over the goal now. But I didn't lower it as much as I could have. If you want the cross bar lowered more than what I have it in the rom you can edit it but you will lose the accurate back of the net collision with players and the puck that I have with this artwork.

Edited by Brodeur30

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16 hours ago, Brodeur30 said:

You can adjust this further the problem is if you lower it farther than the setting I have it on you will lose the back of the net collision and the goal will not look as good visually. I think in actuality the top goal of the smallest goal is how it looks in the screenshot with the higher crossbar

I'll take your word for it. A shinny style game wouldn't have any goalies on the ice either. If the goals are smaller it'd kind of end up being like a game of power ball from American Gladiators - if anyone remembers that - which I think would be really cool.

Also, please post the values / offsets when you have time in the How-To, subforum. Thanks!

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2 hours ago, clockwise said:

I'll take your word for it. A shinny style game wouldn't have any goalies on the ice either. If the goals are smaller it'd kind of end up being like a game of power ball from American Gladiators - if anyone remembers that - which I think would be really cool.

Also, please post the values / offsets when you have time in the How-To, subforum. Thanks!

Ha I love the American Gladiators analogy, The event you're talking about was Powerball right, where players would try to dunk soccer balls into those tiny goals while getting tackled. Playing on the smallest goal I've made here doesn't quite feel that small though you could make the goal literally tiny like a square if you wanted to.

The values / offsets can be found in this topic :

 

It turns out that the same code that controls the boards barrier also controls the barrier of the goal posts / goal. (as it relates to the puck, not players necessarily) When I created that topic at first I didn't realize that the code also controls the size of the goal. I did all the heavy lifting for you here, by editing the goal artwork to match these smaller goal barriers by changing the code.

The smallest goal rom is almost ready for release, the rom I will be releasing not only contains the smaller goal mod but it's also packed full of a ton of my other mods to give you a complete smaller goal gameplay experience. I lowered goalies "Glove left" and "Glove right" ratings in NOSE down to 0 or 1 values so shots deflect more off goalies instead of being caught. Even with this it's still very hard to score. You'll see, you're about to have a lot of fun. I can't wait for you guys to test this smaller goal rom!

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This would be interesting for 2v2.

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There is a RAM code that I found that greatly improves the accuracy of the collision between the puck and the goal posts by solving an NHL 94 bug that some of you may have noticed. This is a very exciting development which I want to share with you when I release the smallest goal rom. In addition to the main barriers rom code that I shared in the other topic, there are also RAM codes for each goal (top and bottom) that allow you to move each goal around so you can fine tune the location of the goal in-game pixel by pixel. Unlike the other rom code, these RAM codes physically move the goal itself (goal artwork and all) and in essence it allows you to alter the actual location of the goal-line as it relates to the goal-line artwork. Well I've found that these goal-moving RAM codes work brilliantly with this mod. Since the area that I used to make the narrower side posts are not editable in the goal art tiles, to get this to work the art I used for the top goal's narrower side posts are stationary artwork that do not move with the goal when you use these goal-moving RAM codes. So this means that when you use these RAM codes to fine-tune the location of the smaller top goal, it only moves the top part of the goal visually with the side posts staying in place.

Why these RAM codes are needed for this mod is because of a problem that exists in NHL 94 that you may have noticed. The problem is that the top goal's goal-line is not quite aligned with the goal-line of the bottom goal. This is something that you may have noticed if you slow-motion a goal in replay and then go to the Reverse Angle right when the puck is about to cross the goal-line, if you look at when the puck appears to cross the goal-line and you freeze frame it right as the puck is crossing the goal line and warping into the net and you reverse angle it, you may have noticed that on the reverse angle the puck may already appear to be in the back of the net while it's not in the back of the net yet on the other angle.

How this relates to accurate puck / goal-post collision is important, because without using this RAM code, no matter what you do from an artwork perspective, the collision will always be a couple of pixels off in regard to the cross bar and the goal-line. This was a source of frustration for me because, well, I was about to release this mod right but the collision between the puck and the crossbar on the top goal was still a little off.

Well just this morning I wanted to see if I could do something about this, and I went in and re-edited the top goal art to move the cross bar 3 pixels higher right, and then after I did that, I then went into the game and used a single-byte goal-moving RAM code for the top goal to move the top part of the goal 3 pixels down to align the goal artwork that way. What this does is that it aligns the top goal with the bottom goal as it relates to the puck crossing the goal-line. So now when you slow-mo a goal replay of the puck crossing the goal-line, the puck now crosses the goal-line into the goal at the same exact frame in both the top and bottom goal!! This was a huge breakthrough for me, because until now the top goal was still 3 pixels off vertically from where the puck intersected the top goal's boundaries despite the top and bottom goals being the same height. Without this gem of a RAM code that I stumbled across a while back that I finally applied today, you had no way to make both goals have accurate collision barriers with the puck. The only thing you could do is make the top goal's cross bar 3 pixels higher than it should be which didn't look right. Now that I've figured all this out, and put it all together, all I gotta say is WOW is this cool.

More testing is needed to make sure it's all working properly, that means me playing a couple of long games trying to hit the cross bar and seeing how accurate everything is. What this will mean though is that for this mod to be accurate for both the top and bottom goal, you will need to run a single-byte RAM code as you are running the rom or else the top portion of the top goal will be separated from the posts visually and the goal-lines won't be aligned.

So my question to you guys is how do you run roms Do you use Gens or do you use another method? The good news is I tested the rom in Gens with the RAM code and as long as you keep the RAM / Game Genie code Active it works. However depending on what emulator you use, using RAM codes may not be possible, and even some that do run Game Genie RAM codes, the code may not stay on while you're playing the game. (the code may return to its original value when there is a face-off for example)

Before I release the rom I just wanted to know how ya'll run your roms. Do you use Gens or do you use a different emulator? If your emulator does not run RAM codes properly like Gens does or if you run just the rom without the RAM code then the top goal will be separated from the side-posts visually. What I plan on doing when I release this rom is to accompany it with a .pat file with the RAM code to move the goal and two other codes. By running the .pat and turning on the RAM code ON, it may work initially but then may get reset every time there's a face-off. (even with the code set to ON) Gens doesn't have this problem but some emulators might, while other emulators might not run Game Genie RAM codes at all. Do any of you use .pat files to run Game Genie RAM codes??

I could have just released the rom by itself but it's important that you use the RAM code as well so you can align the top goal's goal-line with the bottom goal's goal-line and so you can experience the best puck / post accuracy possible. Otherwise you would still have pucks appearing to go through the top goal cross bar and scoring goals when in actuality it's just an NHL 94 bug that has the top goal a couple of pixels off compared to the bottom goal.

When you're as deep into this as I am you start to notice things on a pixel by pixel level. When playing on bigger goals, the puck / goal collision is so inaccurate that you may not notice what alls going on. But you may have noticed that the bottom goal is more aligned with the puck than the top goal is. This NHL 94 bug is what this goal-moving RAM code solves (on any goal size) but it's particularly noticeable on the smaller goals.

After I release this puppy, I plan on posting in some other topics on here which have helped me make this rom what it is today. I really want you guys to experience this mod fully and truly with the best puck / goalpost accuracy possible so this is why I will be releasing the ROM along with this goal-moving Game Genie RAM code included. Hopefully you have a way to run Game Genie RAM codes or just regular RAM codes so that you can use experience this fully!!

Edited by Brodeur30
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A lot of people use Gens, but we have recently started using Retroarch, which uses Genesis Plus GX.  

Having said that, even though you are manipulating RAM addresses there is most likely  a way to alter the actual ROM that loads those RAM addresses.  I know I've worked with you on that with you on some of your previous RAM finds.

For example, let's say you have a RAM address such as FF1234 that has a value of "0001".  You go and change the RAM address to "0002" and recognize the change in the game.  

Now, in the ROM, there must be some instruction or set of instructions that say something like "load value 0001 to RAM address FF1234".  If we find that part of the game code, you can change the ROM to say 0002 instead of 0001.  That way the game will work with your hack on any emulator or hardware.

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Solitaire Play with the human player having the smaller goal and the CPU still having the regular goal would be amazing.:exciting:

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8 hours ago, kingraph said:

A lot of people use Gens, but we have recently started using Retroarch, which uses Genesis Plus GX.  

Having said that, even though you are manipulating RAM addresses there is most likely  a way to alter the actual ROM that loads those RAM addresses.  I know I've worked with you on that with you on some of your previous RAM finds.

For example, let's say you have a RAM address such as FF1234 that has a value of "0001".  You go and change the RAM address to "0002" and recognize the change in the game.  

Now, in the ROM, there must be some instruction or set of instructions that say something like "load value 0001 to RAM address FF1234".  If we find that part of the game code, you can change the ROM to say 0002 instead of 0001.  That way the game will work with your hack on any emulator or hardware.

Thank you for this response kingraph. You've been a big help in the past and perhaps you can help me with this one as well. This is one area that I have had difficulty with. I have tried to use the trace code feature in Gens, I have gone step by step through Tony H's guide several times but for some reason attempting to trace anything through this feature just doesn't seem to "work" for me whatsoever. I've gone through all the steps but it doesn't output any rom addresses as it's supposed to do.

I really could use some assistance with trying to get this particular RAM code (the one that moves the top goal 3 pixels down in-game) to a ROM code, before releasing this ROM so you guys won't need to keep the RAM code active all game to get this to work.

Some RAM codes can be found in the rom just by searching its default value. This is not one of them. This RAM address that moves the top goal up/down in-game starts out at 00 when you start a rom and it becomes 0C when the game hits the main menu, and stays at 0C when you enter a game. I change it to 09 to move the goal down 3 pixels. I'll send you the RAM address OK and if you can find its location so a ROM edit can change the top goal's default position you'd be a real hero here. Then I can just share the rom without any need for a RAM code to be active all game!

Edit : Turns out that was one of them, that could be found in the ROM by its default value. I found it in the ROM by searching the default value of the RAM address through the ROM by using Find / Replace in a hex editor and then testing the rom until i found it. I still have not been able to use the Gens trace feature successfully but I have been able to find several RAM codes in the ROM just by using Find / Replace in a hex editor, and searching the value of the RAM's default value in the rom.

Edited by Brodeur30

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40 minutes ago, CoachMac said:

Solitaire Play with the human player having the smaller goal and the CPU still having the regular goal would be amazing.:exciting:

Haha I'm not sure this one is possible because the code that makes the goals smaller or bigger (and adjust the boards barrier at the same time) affects both the top goal and the bottom goal equally. Interestingly though, playing with the RAM code that moves the top goal up/down seems to have an affect on how easy it is to score on the top goal with your team playing going up vs scoring on the bottom goal with your team going down. This is why I'm hoping to get this RAM code converted to a ROM code to eliminate any such imbalance between playing going up vs going down. I'm wondering if this is simply a result of having a RAM code Active that's altering the top goal's position or if it's somehow affecting the A.I. with having less pixels for the defense to defend since it essentially moves the goal-line in code.

Edited by Brodeur30

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How does the smaller goal affect a players ability to "aim the shot"? Will it still go top corner, or will some of those shots now miss to the outside?

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56 minutes ago, jer_33 said:

How does the smaller goal affect a players ability to "aim the shot"? Will it still go top corner, or will some of those shots now miss to the outside?

Shots miss the net to the outside a lot more, including more shots that go over the goal and over the goalie hitting the boards higher up on the boards behind the goal. It seems that the aiming of shots is greatly affected by lowering the barriers, making shots go wider and more off-target.

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Good news ! I found the code in the rom by searching for the default value of the RAM code. So now both the top and bottom goal have aligned puck / post collision. The only issue with it is when going into Instant Replay and selecting Reverse Angle. Doing all this creates a lot of issues with the Reverse Angle of instant replay. (In the Reverse Angle, the bottom goal ends up 3 pixels higher than where it should be, because it's really the top goal just in reverse, which has been moved 3 pixels closer to the other goal, but with the normal bottom goal artwork. And the reverse angle top goal has issues, it's 3 pixels too higher and is missing side posts)

So the Reverse Angle of Instant Replay has issues with this, so aside from that I think I've finally got the puck / post collision where I needs it to be! Just some additional testing is needed to make sure this is working properly and a couple more minor art edits and this rom should be ready for release.

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I've been doing a lot of goalie ratings adjustments to make this rom more playable with the smallest goal, like turning down goalie's Glove Left and Glove Right ratings to 0. It seems that there's a big difference between setting both Glove Left and Glove Right to 0 vs setting only one of them to 0 and the other to 1.

With both Glove Left and Glove Right at 0, a lot about the game changes : Goalies will not be able to able to catch too many pucks, occasionally they will but not shots with power on them, even some passes deflect off the goalie. This adds an important gameplay element to NHL 94 that I really had never experienced up until now. With both Glove Left and Glove Right set to 0 it appears to affect the entire team not just the goalie, as this causes there to be a lot more deflections on passes and just in general even when the goalie isn't involved. I am considering setting all the goalies in the game to 0 for Glove Left and Glove Right as it works well with the smaller mod as it's still hard to score even with the goalie deflections when the goal is this small. I don't want to make it too easy to score but I must say that playing against a goalie rated 0 for Glove Left and Glove Right is really fun especially with the small goals. With bigger goals turning these to 0 would make it too easy to score but with smaller goals it gives you more opportunities for deflections and opportunities sometimes to aim at open goals when the goalie is out of position after a deflection. I have found that even when I free up space from a deflection to get a shot on an open net I will miss the open net since with the smaller barriers the shot accuracy has been reduced. So I find myself in battles with just trying to aim the puck into the goal, it's a very cool experience that I think you will like when i release this rom.

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When you finish the large goal, let me know!

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3 hours ago, seamor said:

When you finish the large goal, let me know!

Will do, I will be releasing the smallest goal rom first. Then I'll see what I can do with the bigger size goals.

The smallest goal rom is pretty much ready to go, I'm just editing goalie ratings at this point trying to see how lowering certain goalie attributes affects them as it relates to the smaller goal. With the smaller goal you can really lower a lot of the goalie attributes and it's still hard to score due to the size of the goal. One thing I'm trying to get is a lot more deflections and rebounds, instead of the goalies just catching shots. I've heard that lowering "Puck Control" creates more rebounds, but it appears that lowering Glove Left and Glove Right may also create more rebounds as well. And I'm still not quite sure what Stick Left and Stick Right does.

So I've lowered every goalie's Glove Left and Glove Right to 0, and I'm reducing Goalie's Agility and Defensive Awareness ratings. Off and Def Awareness are usually equal but I kept Offensive Awareness of goalie's as is, as I'm guessing that relates to the CPU accuracy of goalies passing the puck out to teammates when they have the puck. So I've lowered Def Awareness by 1, lowered Agility by 2, I think these lower goalie ratings should work better with the smaller goal, as they have less area to defend so they don't need to be as agile or as Aware to still be effective at keeping pucks out of the net. But I don't want to lower them too far so they let easy goals in. That's why I hesitate to lower Puck Control too much because I heard that lowering that too low I heard may cause them to make errors and possibly let routine shots get past them.

I am hoping to release this rom after Thanksgiving like by Saturday or Sunday. I just want to get these goalie ratings all set before release.

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1 hour ago, Brodeur30 said:

I've heard that lowering "Puck Control" creates more rebounds, but it appears that lowering Glove Left and Glove Right may also create more rebounds as well. And I'm still not quite sure what Stick Left and Stick Right does.

Glove Left and Glove Right attribute rating appears to only affect your goalie if he catches left or right.  Obviously, one cannot catch left and right with only one glove.  I also don't believe that the game developers intended it to mean that a goalie who is left handed catching is also rated on how they reach across their body to catch on the right side.  That is not a in-game animation.  Same with Stick Left and Stick Right which, translates to Blocker Side effectiveness.  Some call blocker side the "stick side" when the defection/save is made with the stick vs blocker.  So perhaps, that's why it is called that in the video game?  The problem is, if you have a left hand catching goalie and only do the attribute adjustments for glove left and stick right, and zeros for glove right and stick left, it lowers the goalie's overall rating anywhere between 2 to 12 points.  There is no logic in the game that disables (for example) Glove Left's impact on the overall rating, if your goalie catches right-handed.  So, they remain in the game in the event a goalie is left handed or right handed.  It's weird to have it as it effects the overall rating but there are other strange things about the game that exist so, it's not that surprising. 

I have done a lot of testing on the Glove/Stick theory that I have mentioned, with altering those four attributes, and I'm 99% that this is the case.  I had zeroed the opposite catching/stick hands and didn't notice an impact other than the goalie being weaker/stronger glove side or blocker side.  I got away from it as I didn't like the impact on overall rating.  Also, originally, I thought that "stick left/right" might impact how a goalie passes left side or right side (as far fetched as that sounds).  However, it didn't see it impacted with low vs high stick ratings.  Plus, in the original game, Patrick Roy and Ed Belfour are rated higher on the stick rating than Ron Hextall and there's no way either was better at passing them him.  Only Marty Brodeur can compete with Hex in that area.  Anywho...

Perhaps it is good idea to rate, if for example you have a left-hand catching goalie with a good glove hand, something to the effect of:

Glove Left: 5
Glove Right: 5
Stick Left: 4
Stick Right: 4

OR;

Glove Left: 5
Glove Right: 4
Stick Left: 5
Stick Right: 4


For the most part, the original version of NHL94 does one of these two structures.  There are only a few exceptions in the original which could have been just human error. 

And yes, lowering puck control does create more rebounds.

Edited by The Sauce

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2 hours ago, The Sauce said:

Glove Left and Glove Right attribute rating appears to only affect your goalie if he catches left or right.  Obviously, one cannot catch left and right with only one glove.

So can you speak to how turning every goalie in the game to Glove Left and Glove Right equal to 0 would affect them? Would zeroing those out cause the goalies to stop catching left or right, or would it cause them to still attempt to catch left or right but instead of catching it, it bouncing off their gloves?

And for Stick Left and Stick Right, would zeroing those out cause Goalies to stop attempting stick saves or would it just cause stick save attempts to become less successful? Would it cause stick saves to hit the stick but then go through the stick more into the goal or something?

I'm really not too concerned with how lowering Goalie ratings affects the Goalie Overall ratings, because I'm making these changes across the board to all goalies in the game evenly. Lowering the size of the goal as I have makes it that much harder to score just by that alone, so I am perfectly OK with Goalie's Overall ratings lowering quite a bit since it will still be quite difficult to score goals on lower rated Goalies with the smaller goal.

Edited by Brodeur30

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And just as an FYI the reason why I zeroed out Glove Left and Glove Right to begin with was to try to avoid those instances of shots on open nets with the Goalie out of position ending up being "saved" by Goalies due to an invisible barrier forcefield that causes the puck to magnetically attract to the goalie despite the goalie's player model being several pixels away from the puck. Anotherwords shots that should have been goals ended up being saved by this invisible glove force field and stopped from going into the goal, then being attracted to the Goalie's glove like a magnet. Any idea how to prevent that from happening? (I thought zeroing Glove Left and Glove Right would solve this but it's a hard thing to reproduce in game)

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14 minutes ago, Brodeur30 said:

So can you speak to how turning every goalie in the game to Glove Left and Glove Right equal to 0 would affect them? Would zeroing those out cause the goalies to stop catching left or right, or would it cause them to still attempt to catch left or right but instead of catching it, it bouncing off their gloves?

And for Stick Left and Stick Right, would zeroing those out cause Goalies to stop attempting stick saves or would it just cause stick save attempts to become less successful? Would it cause stick saves to hit the stick but then go through the stick more into the goal or something?

I'm really not too concerned with how lowering Goalie ratings affects the Goalie Overall ratings, because I'm making these changes across the board to all goalies in the game evenly. Lowering the size of the goal as I have makes it that much harder to score just by that alone, so I am perfectly OK with Goalie's Overall ratings lowering quite a bit since it will still be quite difficult to score goals on lower rated Goalies with the smaller goal.

Of course it’s going to effect them and their abilities.  As to what degree, I’ve never been tempted to test.  But, it’s no different then lowering a players scoring ability or skating speed.  The game has the ratings for a reason.  Now, guys with a scoring accuracy of 1 can score at times.  But, you’d be hard pressed to get them a hat trick or maybe even two goals in a game. As to how much a goalie with a glove hand of 0 or 1 does vs a goalie with a glove hand of 3-6 range, I can’t advise.  That’s something you’d have to try out.  Because you are making the goals smaller, it may be a non-factor.  I’d recommend first testing on a rom that has a regular size goal (per the original game specs) and edit two goalies to have a low glove and blocker/stick rating.  Then, try one timers and wrist shots and see what happens.  Then try it against the same goalies but raise their glove hand and stick side ratings.  That should give you a sense of the impact of lowering the attributes.  But again, it “may” not matter with your smaller goal size.

Edited by The Sauce

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18 minutes ago, The Sauce said:

Of course it’s going to effect them and their abilities.  As to what degree, I’ve never been tempted to test.  But, it’s no different then lowering a players scoring ability or skating speed.  The game has the ratings for a reason.  Now, guys with a scoring accuracy of 1 can score at times.  But, you’d be hard pressed to get them a hat trick or maybe even two goals in a game. As to how much a goalie with a glove hand of 0 or 1 does vs a goalie with a glove hand of 3-6 range, I can’t advise.  That’s something you’d have to try out.  Because you are making the goals smaller, it may be a non-factor.  I’d recommend first testing on a rom that has a regular size goal (per the original game specs) and edit two goalies to have a low glove and blocker/stick rating.  Then, try one timers and wrist shots and see what happens.  Then try it against the same goalies but raise their glove hand and stick side ratings.  That should give you a sense of the impact of lowering the attributes.  But again, it “may” not matter with your smaller goal size.

I have been trying it out with lowered Goalie's Glove Left and Glove Right. And see my other comment above about why I lowered Goalie's Glove Left and Glove Right to begin with. I was trying to solve the problem of goalies saving shots that should have been goals. You know, shots that are headed towards an open net with the Goalie out of position but then the puck magically being pulled away from being a goal at the last second by some kind of a force field attracting the puck to their Gloves despite the glove being nowhere near the puck. I may have solved this by lowering every goalie's Glove Left and Glove Right to 0, the problem is it's a hard thing to reproduce in-game. Basically, with smaller goals I don't want the Goalies to be saving shots that they shouldn't be when you do have a shot on an open net. I haven't really seen this happen since I've lowered goalie's Glove Left and Glove Right to 0 but again it's not something that happens very often, but when it does it's annoying and it looks ridiculous, because again scoring chances become very rare on the smaller goals, especially the smallest goal that I will be releasing, and I don't want Goalies to be able to unrealistically save shots that should be goals by pucks being stopped from an invisible barrier like a magnet changing direction mid-flight right into their Glove when the Glove was not close enough to the puck to where it should have been saved.

So that's why I've been lowering Glove Left and Glove Right to 0, to try to prevent those instances from happening. (the invisible forcefield Glove saves, as if the Goalie's glove is a magnet pulling the puck to it even though the Glove isn't close enough to the puck to be saved) Do you think it's possible that lowering Glove Left and Glove Right to 0 stops this phenomena of pucks headed towards open nets being pulled by an invisible magnetic force field to a Goalie's Glove?

Edited by Brodeur30

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35 minutes ago, Brodeur30 said:

I have been trying it out with lowered Goalie's Glove Left and Glove Right. And see my other comment above about why I lowered Goalie's Glove Left and Glove Right to begin with. I was trying to solve the problem of goalies saving shots that should have been goals. You know, shots that are headed towards an open net with the Goalie out of position but then the puck magically being pulled away from being a goal at the last second by some kind of a force field attracting the puck to their Gloves despite the glove being nowhere near the puck. I may have solved this by lowering every goalie's Glove Left and Glove Right to 0, the problem is it's a hard thing to reproduce in-game. Basically, with smaller goals I don't want the Goalies to be saving shots that they shouldn't be when you do have a shot on an open net. I haven't really seen this happen since I've lowered goalie's Glove Left and Glove Right to 0 but again it's not something that happens very often, but when it does it's annoying and it looks ridiculous, because again scoring chances become very rare on the smaller goals, especially the smallest goal that I will be releasing, and I don't want Goalies to be able to unrealistically save shots that should be goals by pucks being stopped from an invisible barrier like a magnet changing direction mid-flight right into their Glove when the Glove was not close enough to the puck to where it should have been saved.

So that's why I've been lowering Glove Left and Glove Right to 0, to prevent those instances from happening.

You’re trying to making a video game be “realistic.”  That’s not going to happen.  All video games are unrealistic in one way or another.  I get where you are coming from though but, I’m not sure how realistic you can make a video game, especially one that added features to increase scoring chances (the one-timer).  The irony of “realism” is that you’re looking to make it hard to score yet, scoring is up in the NHL over the last two seasons.  It’s the highest it’s been since 1992-93.  

I certainly do believe that by making the goals smaller, you’ll be able to achieve low(er) scoring games as you are making it hard for folks to score.  You may also be on to something with the low glove/stick ratings.  I’m not sure what a 0 vs a 6 rating does for the glove or blocker other than, making them stop more snappers and hard wrist shots on frequency.  But if you confirm that it causes even more rebounds, that is interesting to know and I’d be curious to test it on a non-custom rom (as I enjoy me some juicy rebounds/dirty goals).

Edited by The Sauce

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